Aberrant RPG - Invulnerabilities

[Trollroot]

Could you use Invulnerability: Gravity to save yourself from a fall? Would Invulnerability: Time keep you from aging?

Any other interesting side benefits from invulnerabilities you can think of?

[Bahamut810]

I dont think it would work like that. All they do is provide you extra soak. If you ST wants to say they do more, that is of course up to him.

If it did have effect like that, then would be in a constant state of weightlessness with Invunerability: Gravity and get an uncontroller flight for free. ::wink

[Alex Green]

Extra soak or auto-succ to resist. The later normally apply to willpower, but I see no reason they couldn't apply to Stamina type resistances.

INV: Gravity wouldn't let you fly (or float). It would help you resist most (but not all) Gravity Manipulation techniques, and it would soak any G-M "bolts". Ironically I don't think it would help with big falls (it isn't the gravity that hurts, its the sudden stop).

INV: Time wouldn't prevent you from normal ageing (although it would prevent most temporal manipulation effects as those are resisted).

INV: Poison would rock since it would provide soak against something that isn't usually soaked and it would also provide resistance auto-succ.

[Sprocket]

Don't forget the "Broad Category" Extra for this power, folks. If you think INV: Poison rocks, then just think of what INV: Bioweapons could do. ::wink Poisons, diseases, harmful drugs of all sorts... A nova with that form of Invulnerability could shrug them all off with ease.

[Sphere]

Invulnerable: Sarcasm

That'll show those mean mega-socials. Laugh at my cape will ya!

[Trollroot]

Invulnerability: Emotional Manipulation might work, and be quite in theme for some of the more alien characters.

Invulnerability: Biologicals would probably rock more against bioattacks than Adaptability, since Adaptability gives you a number of other additional goodies. Wouldn't help against inorgainc poisons though.

The Invulnerability: Time came from trying to convert some longlived characters over. I figured Invulnerability: Time, with 5 levels of weakness: aging only covered it well in terms of both balance and mechanics. (Adaptability giving extended lifespan and a lot of other benefits for 3 np, the Invulnerability giving extended lifespan only for 1 np. System: The character ages one year for every "soak vs againg" years that pass)

Then I started thinking that this implied that normal Invulnerability: Time would have to include this as a benefit, and started wondering what other small unexpected things unusual Invulnerabilities could provide.

On the Gravity issue, for example, perhaps reduced acceleration due to gravity?

[Sphere]

I think there'd have to be a certain amount of common sense involved in Invulnerability.

However...

Considering that gravity is one of the quantum forces, your Nova is effectively cutting themself off from part of their power source if their Invulnerability refers to ALL gravity.

So... +6 Diff to using all powers sound alright? ::biggrin

Plus it's not technically the gravity that's causing the damage, it's the hitting something at high speed.

If you're immune to time then doesn't that impair your ability to operate within normal time/space? You aren't affected by the procedure of one moment to the next so you either don't exist from everyone else's perspective or you're a never-changing statue.

Surely Bodymod: Longevity would be easier?

[Sphere]

My Players want Invulnerable: Totentanz.

Well that or Reflexive Teleport (the presence of Totentanz).

[Trollroot]

In general, a Novas own powers prevent nasty sideeffects like that. They would be fair applications if the player was tainted enough, though.

And perhaps a powermax could keep gravity from giving you that nasty speed?

Invulnerability to biologicals would probably have immunity to normal diseases as a nice side effect. I can't see even a nasty normal disease getting by a single dot of invulnerability.

And Bodymod: Longevity would probably work just as well. There are many ways of slowing aging, after all. Different name for the same effect perhaps.

[Alex Green]

On the Gravity issue, for example, perhaps reduced acceleration due to gravity?

Nope. That part of it isn’t soaked and it isn’t resisted, so he’s out of luck. The appropriate power for this sort of thing is “flight”.

My Players want Invulnerable: Totentanz.

It could be done, but getting it to fit inside a theme is a challenge. “I don’t like him” won’t do it.

Before any one laughs, someone with Q-Mimic could get “INV: Who ever I’m mimicking” to reflect that he becomes immune to their powers when he gets their signature.

Well that or Reflexive Teleport (the presence of Totentanz).

Not a good idea. “Reflexive” effects have to be defined a head of time, and this would be a combat teleport. So how, exactly, do you define it? 500 meters left? Right? Up? Down? Pretty near any pre-defined definition could be easily used against you. Worse, a reflex has to have some way to trigger it, and Totentanz won’t trigger it if you don’t know he is there.

RE: Invulnerability to biologicals

Depending on how you define it, this may be too large even for a BC. Most novas are biologicals.

[Sphere]

Well, I wasn't planning on giving it to them. We were joking around.

It's the image of a group of people suddenly vanishing in bursts of energy towards a variety of random locations leaving behind a confused Totentanz.

Of course the flip side is any building would be secure against my Players. Just hire T to stand around looking impressive. They try to walk in dressed as clowns and instantly get teleported off to random locations. ::biggrin

[Alex Green]

instantly get teleported off to random locations.

Not random. Predetermined. ::laugh

[Sphere]

Depending on various factors (Quantum and Power dice pool) it's actually anywhere along a predetermined "line". So the middle of a busy street in NYC, a corridor in Bahrain, or the middle of the ocean. All possible arrival points.

Of course Players being Players my lot would no doubt each choose a separate location being paranoid of reprisals and traps. So if we drew a diagram of their teleport pathways it'd be like a star spreading out in various direction.

How's about Teleport linked with Intuition? First sign of danger and you're out of there. Of course your teammates might be a little annoyed when you constantly jaunt off just before the elites attack.

Invulnerable: Conspiracies anyone?

Invulnerable: Taint? For the munchkin games?

Actually one actually possible Invulnerability would be Invulnerable: Pretercognition. No one can see where you'll be.

[Alex Green]

Actually one actually possible Invulnerability would be Invulnerable: Pretercognition. No one can see where you'll be.

Nope. INV:Light doesn't make you invisible. Pretercognition doesn't cause damage and isn't resisted by anything. You'd get 6 soak if someone attacked with Q-Bolt(Pretercognition), but that's pretty rare I would think. ::blink

Invisibility could work, or perhaps the ST would let you create a power like "Silence" specifically against Pretercognition. ::ninja

Or perhaps gadgets.

[Sprocket]

Re: INV Biologicals-

::blink What I had in mind for that particular BC was stuff like drugs, poisons, diseases, parasites, etc. IMHO, "other novas" would definitely be out-of-bounds for that BC! ::smile

[madcat82]

INV: Quantum... for the powergamers ::biggrin

[Alex Green]

Already banned.

[Sphere]

Invulnerability: Primates. Soak everyone's damage! ::wink

[Alex Green]

INV: Mega-Strength based attacks has potential. So does INV: Bullets.

[Nullifier]

Wouldn't INV: Blunt and INV: Piercing cover those two things rather well? Then there's INV: Cutting, INV: Explosive (might fight explosive decompression from short-term vaccum exposure as a side-effect). Among others... But to do it for things as specific as Mega-Str attacks and bullets is missing the point. Inv's protect against a particular category of damage/effects, not specific ones, at least from the examples I've seen in the books.

[madcat82]

hmm, INV: Rott...

would that work? perhaps only at rotting things trown at you or quantum bolt rott...

[Alex Green]

But to do it for things as specific as Mega-Str attacks and bullets is missing the point. Inv's protect against a particular category of damage/effects, not specific ones, at least from the examples I've seen in the books.

Mostly True. That's the way it's supposed to be done, but this thread is (more or less) about wacky INVs, and INV:Bullets doesn't strike me as abusive (although theme might be a problem).

[Trollroot]

The way I understand Invulnerability, you need to be protected from the damage medium, not the source. By which I mean, if you are shot at, Inv: bullets is good. Inv:guns is not.

If you are hit with a rifle, the other way around.

I think you could do Inv: biologicals in two ways, if you worked on the wording. One for very small damage agents, bacteria, virii, maybe nanobased attacks. And one for flesh. Get both with a BC.

I don't think Inv:Flesh is all that broken. It basically protects you from being hit, and Mega-Strength. Unless the attacker picks up a lead pipe, or wears very thick gloves.

Also there is the "define your power" issue. A flight-forcefield-Megastrength character may define his powers as gravity based, in which case Inv:gravity protects from the Mega part of strength damage. And a temporal mainpulator may learn Disintegrate to get some offence. Defining it a "temporally desynchronising parts of an object" in which case Inv:time is quite handy.

[Alex Green]

I don't think Inv:Flesh is all that broken. It basically protects you from being hit, and Mega-Strength.

I don’t think INV:Flesh would be a BC. “Thick Gloves” might include Eufiber (although I lean towards “no”, Eufiber should be treated as the underlying nova). “Mega-Strength” would only be sometimes considering it wouldn’t work against Bodymorph(any), most types of claws, or thrown objects.

[Trollroot]

Good point. "Flesh" might be more useful than I thought, as many Novas habitually will attune gloves, lead pipes etc. Attuned objects might be covered too. Opponent Novas won't know the wording of the invulnerability.

[Sphere]

God I'm glad you people aren't Players in my group ::wink

There are only two broad spectrum Invulnerability powers that should be allowed by any right-thinking GM and those are Kinetic (Physical) and Energy.

Everything else should be either defense against a specific Quantum Power (ie Invulnerability: Time Manipulation) or a specific damage source. So Invulnerability: Radiation grants soak against damage against the soft/hard radiation sources spoken about in the corebook.

Invulnerable: Flesh protects you against a bare-knuckle punch sure. But your attacker could wrap his fists in, for instance, clingfilm for a one-punch knockdown (if he was a mega-strong).

An attuned object is not flesh so it cannot be soaked. Attuned objects are simply synchronised with the Nova's quantum field so that quantum effects don't damage it. It's still made of the same material.

Eufiber is a synthetic material not flesh. Same thing applies.

[Alex Green]

God I'm glad you people aren't Players in my group  ::wink

Thank you (I think).

Invulnerable: Flesh protects you against a bare-knuckle punch sure. But your attacker could wrap his fists in, for instance, clingfilm for a one-punch knockdown (if he was a mega-strong).

True, although (as you said) the clingfilm would break on the first hit.

An attuned object is not flesh so it cannot be soaked. Attuned objects are simply synchronised with the Nova's quantum field so that quantum effects don't damage it. It's still made of the same material.

Also True. An attuned object isn’t flesh.

Eufiber is a synthetic material not flesh. Same thing applies.

I disagree.

First of all, Eufiber’s attunement goes WAY beyond normal attunement rules. From their examples I gather that eufiber acquires your attributes (stamina), abilities (resistance), Mega-Stats (stamina), and enhancements (Health, Adaptability, etc). Normal attunement only allows for powers, not enhancements or mega-stats (much less attributes & abilities).

Second of all, Eufiber (the background rating) is actually alive, and generated from a nova (perhaps as part of his body). You might argue that it’s “hair” or some type of fungus, but “flesh” is as good a definition as any.

Just for ease of use I think calling it “part of the underlying nova” works really well considering it’s origin and abilities. If you turn into steel, so does it. Ditto flame. Ditto flesh.

[metaphysician]

I tend to think that Invulnerability is also the power to pick if you want to resist something not normally resistable. So, yes, I'd allow Invulnerability ( Pretercognition ), defined as "its very hard to perceive your actions across time." Its effect would simply be to give resisted roll sux to the Pretercog roll.

Yeah, its a nonstandard usage, but its better than coming up with a new power, and its cleaner that coming up with a heavily limited and modified Invisibility. Just needs an in-character justification.

On a vaguely similar note, Invulnerability: Time should also protect you from things like history changes, assuming you allow time travel into the campaign.

OTOH, Invulnerability: Poison doesn't double dip, by my reading. The power writeup is pretty clear that it provides +6 soak, *or* +6 to the resisted roll. Not both.

( as an aside, I think the same should be true of Psychic Shield, and would change it as such in any campaign I ran )

[Finbar]

Second of all, Eufiber (the background rating) is actually alive, and generated from a nova (perhaps as part of his body). You might argue that it’s “hair” or some type of fungus, but “flesh” is as good a definition as any.

Actually, the eufiber grows on its own; it's only grows from one nova's body, and there's a lot of debate about what that means...

That said, what about:

INV: Psionics (for those nasty psiads and psions)

INV: Teleportation ("I am Anchorman!" Heh.)

INV: Plot Device (y'know you wanna!)

FR

[metaphysician]

Actually, the eufiber grows on its own; it's only grows from one nova's body, and there's a lot of debate about what that means...

That said, what about:

INV: Psionics (for those nasty psiads and psions)

INV: Teleportation ("I am Anchorman!" Heh.)

INV: Plot Device (y'know you wanna!)

FR

I'd probably only allow INV: Psionics as a BC. Not that you'd need more than one dots. . .

[Finbar]

Actually, you'd need about two or three...Trust me; I've been known to toss around a lot of dice...

FR

[metaphysician]

Out of curiousity: How? Trinity Psi rules give everything a base dicepool of Psi, which maxes at 10.

( which, admittedly, I've never really likely. Psions should be weaker than novas, but Trinity takes it a little too far. I tend to favor either cutting the Psi point cost and/or adding the discipline rating in autosux. . . )

[Finbar]

Easy: I twink and I apply TPG rules.

Specific: I can spend Psi, getting 2 sux/point. Also, I allow the doubled psi points (as per TPG). So that's a max of (10+20=) 30 sux. Of course, that assumes a max roll and no re-rolling of 10's; that could add a few more sux...

Just 'cause...

FR

[metaphysician]

I *really* need to give the TPG a thorough read-through. . .

[Blue Thunder]

I haven't read the whole thread, forgive me if this was brought up:

What about INV: Specific Nova? This would only apply to thier nova powers...a punch to the face (even a Mega-Str punch) would still cause damage. And while it could make you immune (or nearly immune) to being picked up and tossed around by that nova's Telekinesis, he could still toss a giant boulder at you with Telekinesis. And if he shoots you with a gun while using Claws: Kinetic Discharge, only the damage of the gun will harm the nova, since the Claws will be negated (or greatly reduced). I'm thinking like Cyclops and Havok of the X-Men; they're immune to each other's mutant powers.

The reason for this could be two novas who erupted at the same time and place, and thier powers are somewhat connected. As a result, they both have one or two dots in INV towards each other's quantum abilities. Perhaps because their quantum signatures overlap a bit.

As a weakness on INV: Specific Nova, they could dictate that from time to time, they may experience quantum-related things the other nova experiences...like damage taken from a Qunatum Bolt hurting the other, things seen with Mega-Perception are shared for a brief moment, or a telepath gaining access to both of thier minds.

Just runnng with an idea there.

[Alex Green]

For a nova with Q-Imprint. INV: Nova I'm Imprinted on. Not only do you get his powers but you also get his personal immunity as well. 3 or 4 dots of this is just grimm.

[Centimane]

What about Inv: Quantum Manipulation (granting resistance to Quantum Authority or Supremacy)? Would've been handy for Pax at the end of WW Phase 1, no? On a side note, has anyone ever considered Inv: Sensory attacks? Just two dots gets you more soak than five in Sensory Shield.

[Alex Green]

You mean, INV: Q-Adjusting Powers.

And these sorts of INV run into a problem. INV can pump Willpower, and it can pump soak. A lot of this is resisted by node.

[metaphysician]

I've never seen a reason to not allow Invulnerability to be used for other resistance rolls. Admittedly, a "Quantum Shield" power might be better.

[Alex Green]

I've never seen a reason to not allow Invulnerability to be used for other resistance rolls.

I like it, but the most "by-the-book" ST I've ever met said it was limited to the things shown.