Aberrant: 200X - 2010 Migration (FOR REAL THIS TIME!)

[The Story Guide]

As a member of 200X that doesn't have any characters on the other boards, I'm going to echo The Fool on the count that this does affect us just as much as it affects those with 2010 characters. At this point, I have two characters on this board, and that's all I am allowed to have. Those with 2018 characters can have all of their old character concepts to bring over here and fiddle with for free, as well as two more original characters. And now we're talking about bringing over 2010 ports as well. I have to say, I feel very much like I'm being punished/limited just because I'm new.

I'm told it's because in a few weeks or months most everyone here will have settled down to only two characters anyways because that's what they did on the other boards. Well, I'm not them. *shrugs* It's not worth getting into a tiff about, but it does grate.

As to how this adversely affects 2010, would there even be a discussion of such magnitude on this if that board was still active and effective in entertaining its constituents? This isn't sovereign nations, nor is allowing -not forcing, not requiring, but allowing- those writers that wish to move character concepts over to do so with minimum fuss some weird declaration of war on 2010. To use the sovereign nation metaphor for a moment, since it seems popular, all this is is one nation having an open immigration policy. If the other nation has an issue, that's really their problem and needs to be dealt with internally. Nobody's twisting arms or marching people across national lines at gunpoint.

I'd personally be in favor of having a higher first-year-only total character number allotment for everyone, and having ports from either board cost character slots. But then, I certainly have a bias for wanting it so.

There's my long-winded $0.02.

[Nova OOC]

Don't worry Carver, I have no intention of repeating the events of this time yesterday.

A common theme that I keep hearing is that I am somehow suppressing the will of the people, as defined by one viewpoint, and that the people reject the idea of even limited autocracy. I find that a strange charge since there is a built-in mechanism for voting in the setting, this very topic is going to a vote, and most importantly, I explained before we even began a month ago that the 200X setting is not an unlimited democracy, yes there will be a panel of moderators with executive veto and fiat. This is not a secret, and if people really worried that much about abuse of power, then the 200X setting would not be thriving, now would it?

Maybe, just maybe, people like having a framework in which to create, and like knowing that there are benevolent people watching out for them, eh?

Besides, White Rat, your continued presence in 200X is quite compelling evidence that I do not have unlimited power to do what I will; and you too apparently tacitly approve of this structure, or you would not even be here writing a re-imagined version of White Rat.

[Aušrinė]

Dr. White, you'll notice that while you are ignoring the arguments of others (namely myself and Carver), I am not ignoring your arguments. Take note, because this is how discussions are handled.

Originally Posted By: Dr. Robert White

Originally Posted By: Nova_OOC

It's your choice to frame this discussion in only negative ways. That's not an accurate representation of reality. It's obviously biased and easily discredited. Can't you do better, or is your heart really not in this argument?

I disagree, it is an adequate metaphor for what 200x wishes to do to 2010. You want to make changes to 2010 without the consent of 2010. That is an act of agression by 200X on 2010.

I'm sorry, but can we go over again what changes, or "acts of aggression" are being made to, or forced upon, 2010? In what way, shape, or form are the folks over at 2010 being forced into any course of action that they don't want to take? Are you guys over at 2010 being blackmailed with something? Is someone over here at 200X holding something over your heads? Last time I checked these forums were all free of charge places where people were ostensibly gathering together to have fun. Since there's no money changing hands, since we're all here because we want to be, and since no one has any legal, personal, or martial leverage over anyone else here what is the problem?

Originally Posted By: Dr. Robert White

You also speak of Bias. That's really funny....you are a moderator, and the creator of 200x? You also admit that your creation (200x) is non-democratic.

Wait, where did she admit this? Because I completely missed it, and I'd like to go look that part over. Quote please?

Originally Posted By: Dr. Robert White

You now want to impose on the people of 2010 without them having a say.

Wait, what's being imposed on whom? I am so missing something here...

Sorry, I don't mean to sound sarcastic, but we're discussing whether or not to allow certain characters over here! What happens over at 2010 is 2010's business, and no one is trying to tell them how to conduct that business (maybe I'm wrong there, but I don't think so).

Originally Posted By: Dr. Robert White

So not only do you not allow people in your own forum to vote on things, but you don't want 2010 to vote either.

This statement disproves itself simply because of its location within this very thread. I personally find it somewhat annoying that you would waste RPG-Post's memory space like that.

Originally Posted By: Dr. Robert White

I'd say this illustrates well the reality that humanity seeks to dominate and impose its will on others.

Dude. Seriously. I think you may have taken a wrong turn. GE&R is back that way (GE&R=Gamers, Ethics, & Religion, and is a forum for discussing such things - for those who don't know). I don't mean to come off rude here at all, but can you please stay on topic?

Now, to save you the trouble of having to scroll back:

Originally Posted By: Ausrine

This entire "issue" surrounding the 2010 forum is confusing to me. Honestly, the reason I never really considered getting involved with 2010 is because of the (IMHO) highly anal-retentive charter they have over there. I'm sure they had their reasons, but I'm having none of it. Any character I create is mine, and I'm going to do what I damn well please with them, thank you very, very much.

If some one wants to fork over cold, hard cash for creative rights to my creations, then fine, in that case I've given up certain rights (perhaps all rights) regarding my characters. But otherwise it doesn't matter whether my characters appear in 2010, 2018, or the freaking Core Aberrant book! Anyone who doubts this needs to go do some homework to find out what the rights of Creators are in regards to their creations.

As the Creator of a given character/story/work of art/etc, you have certain basic rights. These include:

Reproduction Right. You have the right to make copies of the original work (in this case, this would mean copying and distributing a fic you did for 2010, or copies of your PC's profile).

Modification Right. You have the right to create derivative works based on the original work. (yeah that's right, try to ignore that one!)

The list goes on, but most of them don't actually apply because any 2010 creation is based in the Aberrant setting which is copyrighted by a large RPG company who will sue your ass if you try and ignore that copyright.

The point is that unless the 2010 Charter (and your tacit agreement with it) grants them Exclusive Rights or All Rights to your creations, then there is no discussion here.

You have the right, not the option, the right to recreate your 2010 characters in whole or in part in the 200X forum. The only question is whether 200X will accept your 2010 PC as an approved character, not whether 2010 likes the idea that your character (or some derivative) exists in another fictional setting.

And for the record, I approve of the idea that 2010 characters should be allowed, but I say that 2010 characters should cost a character slot. I say this only because I too am worried about ending up with a whole slew of characters who show up and then vanish after a few posts, never to show their fictional faces again.

Originally Posted By: Jael Carver

Look, if I bring Kara over (and you ALL know that's exactly what would happen if this happens the way it seems it will), she will not be at all the same as she is. Would that invalidate 2010 Kara? No, because they are completely different universes.

One more time: Completely Different Universes.

If I seem irritated, it's because I am. I don't see why we have to go around and around about this; 2010 is its own place and story with its own tone and events, and 200x should have its own place/story/tone/events. The characters should change from board to board, and they should have a different story and experience on each board. They don't cancel each other out, or contradict one another.

Some of us in 200x had some really awesome characters. I'd love to see some of them make the transition.

And no, 2010 may not be getting much out of the deal. Or there may be a backlash effect of people turning back to the old stories and going, "Hey, this would be fun." We don't know. Personally, if the creative energy of people is better in 200x, I don't want to block that. Let the migration occur. This idea has my vote.

There are the two arguments that most directly debunk your own, White. No semantics, no politics, no bad analogies comparing fictional, non-copyrighted characters and the forums that host them to freaking countries at war..... Just a direct argument to your point of view.

Please respond.

[Dr. Robert White]

Quote:

I'm sorry, but can we go over again what changes, or "acts of aggression" are being made to, or forced upon, 2010? In what way, shape, or form are the folks over at 2010 being forced into any course of action that they don't want to take? Are you guys over at 2010 being blackmailed with something? Is someone over here at 200X holding something over your heads?

I'm not saying that it is a threat to 2010, as a forum, but that it violates the spirit of the 2010 charter. All I have asked for is a vote to amend the charter, and to soothe any hard feeling regarding the transfer of characters.

Quote:

Wait, where did she admit this? Because I completely missed it, and I'd like to go look that part over. Quote please?

Here it is:

Quote:

The overriding authority in this setting is the well-being of the group at large, which is to be determined by frequent polling of opinion and feedback, and overseen by a benevolent triad of autocrats.

-From the post by Nova OOC on April 10'th. post #109934

In case anyone was sleeping during political science class: autocratices and democracies are mutually exclusive.

[Aušrinė]

Originally Posted By: Dr. Robert White

Quote:

I'm sorry, but can we go over again what changes, or "acts of aggression" are being made to, or forced upon, 2010? In what way, shape, or form are the folks over at 2010 being forced into any course of action that they don't want to take? Are you guys over at 2010 being blackmailed with something? Is someone over here at 200X holding something over your heads?

I'm not saying that it is a threat to 2010, as a forum, but that it violates the spirit of the 2010 charter. All I have asked for is a vote to amend the charter, and to soothe any hard feeling regarding the transfer of characters.

If you want to ask for a vote to amend the 2010 charter then fine. Great. But (and this could just be me) I don't think that this thread, in this forum is the place to ask for it. I'm pretty sure you should be taking care of that problem over in 2010.

Originally Posted By: Dr. Robert White

Quote:

Wait, where did she admit this? Because I completely missed it, and I'd like to go look that part over. Quote please?

Here it is:

Quote:

The overriding authority in this setting is the well-being of the group at large, which is to be determined by frequent polling of opinion and feedback, and overseen by a benevolent triad of autocrats.

-From the post by Nova OOC on April 10'th. post #109934

In case anyone was sleeping during political science class: autocratices and democracies are mutually exclusive.

Yeah, I saw that, there were two impressions that I was left with. The first was that it was a central ideal within the 200X forum that all of us have a say in how things are done here. The second was that Nova was being sarcastic and tongue in cheek in her remark.
Explanation: She says (quite explicitly) that the Authority in this setting is the "well-being of the [200X] group at large", which she then explains "is determined by frequent polling of opinion and feedback". She then includes a self-negating remark about it being overseen by "benevolent Autocrats". Either Nova made a statement which is non-sensical, misleading, and completely pointless - or she was joking.

Within the context of her post it looks sarcastic to me, but maybe I was misreading things.

[Jael Carver]

Originally Posted By: Dr. Robert White

I was not trying to be antagonistic. I think it is a legitimate question. Why would someone fear a vote?

Not Flicker. The mods have to agree to put something up for a vote, which is what Seph did. However, this doesn't address why you insist on bringing 2010 into it, and marginalizing those like The_Fool and Malachite who don't get a say. Or even by Reven, who has yanked himself out of the 2010 world and doesn't (by my understanding) get a vote anymore?

Originally Posted By: Dr. Robert White

I'm not saying that it is a threat to 2010, as a forum, but that it violates the spirit of the 2010 charter. All I have asked for is a vote to amend the charter, and to soothe any hard feeling regarding the transfer of characters.

Then bring it up over there, on their forum. And, as I just reread the charter, it doesn't violate the charter to move 2010 characters over.

Now, would you be so kind as to answer Ausrine's questions? She's asked very nicely for you to answer her concerns, which you've ignored thus far. And I'd like to know your opinion on this, which you haven't given, directly.

[Mr Fox]

First of all, agression of one board against another. No. Most of the people in this board are in the other so it would be agression against themselves, and that's just silly.

2010 vs 200x voting. 2010 is welcome to call for a vote over there on whether they will allow characters to leave or not. Since most of the people over there are also the people over here, I suspect that the vote would get shot down pretty handily. Besides which as someone pointed out, writers have rights. Short of banning the people who exported their characters, I'm not sure what 2010 could do about it, and that wouldn't exactly be a smart move.

200x voting: The people here do have the option to voice their opinion on who they wish to let it, regardless of whether they have a character over on 2010 or not. I actually do have a character there though he is inactive, so I could vote either way, but everyone active here is going to be given the chance to have their voice heard on this matter. (That's a MOD speaking.) No one's voice is being suppressed. That's the whole point of this thread.

I will put in my .02 and say that I also agree that 2010 reboots ought to cost a character slot. I'd love to see some of the characters over there in the 200x environment, but I don't want to see a flood of new characters just as we are starting to get a sense of the environment here.

As far as the # of characters a person is allowed goes. I have one character here, and it is one of my new character slots. I didn't have any 2018 characters. I don't have a problem with this disparity in the number of characters, or view this as a Old guard vs New player thing. What concerns me is that those rebooting character may be spreading themselves too thin. This is a 2018 reboot, so there is nothing we can do about that, but I would love to see a general limit on the number of active characters a person can have. That won't happen, but I think it would be benificial. A person can only give attention to so many charcters before stuff starts falling through the cracks. It also means that interactions with others suffers when you have too many to keep track of. I think that was one of the things that sapped the energy out of 2010.

[Jason Grant]

I cannot believe this much time and energy, which could have been spent doing some far more productive - like posting IC and fics, has been wasted on this incredibly pointless non-issue.

Can we please remember that the majority of the people with characters in 2010 also have characters in 200X so there is no real "us or them" here. Can we also remember that any characters from 2010 that make it into 200X are reboots and not transfers. If I decide to reboot TeleForce there is nothing stopping me from posting with him in either forum save my whim. This isn't WoW and he's not moving from 1 server to another.

I don't really see a point to a vote however if that is the way to go then there really needs to be 2 votes. 1 vote to amend the 2010 character to allow the characters to be rebooted in another forum and one in 200X to allow 2010 reboots into the 200X forums.

You know I looked up the definition of redundant in the dictionary and all it said was "See Redundant..."

To be honest the only issue i see here is the unfair character count old timers get ompaired to the new arrivals, and that's about it.

So can we all please get over ourselves and start being creative again?

...

...

Please??

...

...

Pretty please with cherries on top???

[Nova OOC]

I just find it amusing that my thoughts on autocracy are supposedly a scandal, when I've been quite up-front about it all along.

[Mr Fox]

As far as the autocracy vs democracy thing... that shouldn't have even come up in this discussion. We went over and over that in the horrible topic that Overload started during the original vote on the 200x charter. My understanding of the way that discussion turned out was that this was not in fact a democracy. It was in fact a benevolent autocracy. A significant number of people came forward saying that this was Nova's proposal and that if she wanted to say that something was going to be a certain way then it would be and they would follow it. Chosen even stepped in and said that this was Nova's proposal and that anyone who objected could make their own board proposal.

Having said that. Nova chose to make this a 3 mod system, and Nova has not been autocratic nor dictatorial, she has relied on Seph and I, and sought the opinions of the writers. Without the writers there is no board. Ultimately, the writers decided to follow Nova's proposal, and since the board has been active I have not seen any evidence that she, or Seph or I have acted in any way autocratic. We have in fact posted this particular topic so that people could have their say and VOTE on what they wanted to see.

(As a player, not a mod) I am really getting tired of this coming up. This is a benevolent autocracy. Don't like it LEAVE!!!!!! But for Deity's sake stop bringing this crap up. So far we have proven that we are concerned with the players and what they want. No decision has been made arbitrarily, though it could happen in the future. If it does and it pisses you off, "GET THE HELL OUT, and STOP BRINGING THIS SHITE UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

(Sorry, but this crap is annoying me and it is pointless, and is just dragging down what should have been a nice pleasant discussion of what the writers want into the mud.)

[Aušrinė]

Hmmm.

It would seem, upon reading the most recent responses, that I was misreading Nova's quote, and that she was saying this is an Autocracy. My bad.

Further, upon reading the most recent responses, it has become apparent to me that my statement that Nova's remark was either non-sensical, or she was joking, was also incorrect. She wasn't joking, and (after reading Fox's post) it still makes sense. My bad.

My apologies to anyone I confused or offended.

((Psst. Hey Dr. White, this is how you admit you're wrong! Check it out, yo!))

[Mr Fox]

Sorry about the above post. I just really don't want to see this topic go like the previous one that ended up with Overload banned. (He's back btw, and welcomed aboard.) I would say though, that after that whole previous discussion, it really was my understanding that this game was Nova's proposal and a significant number of the writers basically said that they would follow where Nova went since it was her idea. That being said I really don't think that this has been handled at any time or in any way as if it were a dictatorship. This is the first issue that has been proposed and a vote has been called. In cases where someone has proposed something character related it has been referred to the writers when the Mods have been uncomfortable with it, ie fembot manufacturing...

[Nova OOC]

And without giving away too much, I'd like to point out that in a private moderator vote, one of my pet proposals was overridden by the other two moderators. Yet we are still friends, the three of us.

The system works as designed.

[Anne 'Rapture' Joy]

My two cents:

I'd like to port over a character or two from 2010 to 200X (possibly Balm or Flow); should it cost a character slot (hell yes!) and is WR being an ass for the sake of being one? (Hell yes again!)

Given that most of the folks I can name here post (or posted) in both boards, I don't see how a new universe for a character can conflict either version. After all, Regan 'Samhra' McLachlan is a different kettle of fish to Regan 'Pandora' McLachlan.

I vote 'yes' to allow it, with the cost of a character slot.

[Dr. Robert White]

Quote:

I'd like to port over a character or two from 2010 to 200X (possibly Balm or Flow); should it cost a character slot (hell yes!) and is WR being an ass for the sake of being one? (Hell yes again!)

Ain't I a stinker (Ala Bugs Bunny)

But in all seriousnees. Much of my reaction is due to seeing 2010, of which I have resorted considerable resources to, go by the wayside. One day, everyone posted there, the next; nothing. It was like a light was turned off. I think much of it coincided with Singularity, and a few others, leaving, and that after the holidays, everyone felt differently. I enjoyed 2010 precisely because it was democratically constructed, and there was no 'authority', other than a democratically decided upon charter. Maybe parts of the charter need to be amended, as to create an environment conducive to creativity. I don't know.

My other point of contention, is that I have an instinctual and vicerally negative reaction to non-democratic processes. I like systems that have some semblance to Western Liberal society. Democracy is the cornerstone of what makes the West different from systems like Fascism, Communism, despotism, and Authoritarianiam. I like leaders who trust people to be able to make their own decisions, and who respect the individual. When I see things like "well-being of the [200X] group at large...", I instantly think of things like Nobless Obige, and Collectivist ideologies like Communism and Fascism. As I said, it is a viceral and automatic reaction I have. If my gut reaction has caused undue heartache, then welcome to the real world. Not everyone sees things the same. Some decisions will make anyone react negatively. My trigger happens to be anything collectivist. If I have said stuff that was personal or out of line in that manner, then I apologize for that. I will not apologize for being an individual or for not being PC.

Why did I make a character to post in 200x? Because you can't write stories all by yourself. I still needed an outlet for my creativity. It is much easier when you have other to collaborate with.

[Mr Fox]

Understood, but I still don't see where the problem is. This very topic in which we are posting is a result of the mods putting before the people an issue and asking for both an input in shaping the proposal and a vote on said proposal.

[Contessa]

Zzzzzzzz...

[VileBill]

Originally Posted By: Nova OOC

See? SEE?

Okay, that was cheap. Sorry.

Actually it was fucking funny.

[VileBill]

Quote:

I like leaders who trust people to be able to make their own decisions, and who respect the individual.

Man, I have a tough time seeing how your politics work out with that statement. But that's neither here nor there.

Quote:

When I see things like "well-being of the [200X] group at large...", I instantly think of things like Nobless Obige, and Collectivist ideologies like Communism and Fascism. As I said, it is a viceral and automatic reaction I have.

Dude, this is all for fun y'know? This seems a little heavy here.

I don't see the exportation harming 2010 because 2010 is dead. Kaput. Folks stopped enjoying that place for any number of reasons. Me because of the massive EXPLOSION of characters made following shit impossible. Others had their own reasons. But maybe they'd still like to play their characters a bit, but just not there.

[Contessa]

Originally Posted By: Nova OOC

See? SEE?
Okay, that was cheap. Sorry.

[Dr. Robert White]

Quote:

Understood, but I still don't see where the problem is. This very topic in which we are posting is a result of the mods putting before the people an issue and asking for both an input in shaping the proposal and a vote on said proposal.

I just didn't think it was fair to 2010 for people who had no interest in 2010 to vote on things that affected 2010.

Of course all I can do is voice my opinion on any matter. When you are the lone voice speaking against the majority, it is tough. A minority position is always a tough one. You will be attacked, patronized, and marginalized by the majority. All you can do is put forth your voice. Hopefully you can be respected for standing up for what you believe in.

[Warren Verona]

2010 is dead, or at least dying and it's because of bullshit like what's been going on the past few days.

Craig is right, this is for fun so quit with the political bullshit, the jibes, the long ass posts of oneupmanship, and just fix the damn problem.

Hell, I'll fix it. I'll introduce one of my 2010 characters in an hour or so, I still have a free slot for this year. I'll do it with the sole intention of someone from 2010 trying to tell me I can't. Watch me and weep.

And if they say it's okay for me to do so because I'm no longer a writer over there then I will recommend that people just pull their Goddamn characters from 2010 permanently.

I can't believe 15+ adults have this much fucking trouble making a decision. It's insane.

[Nova OOC]

Originally Posted By: Revenant

Hell, I'll fix it. I'll introduce one of my 2010 characters in an hour or so, I still have a free slot for this year. I'll do it with the sole intention of someone from 2010 trying to tell me I can't. Watch me and weep.

I'm telling you right now that it's a problem; you don't have to wait an hour. At just this moment, the 200X Bible forbids that. We're appending the 200X Bible to allow that. Be patient, please, help really is on the way. I promise. Drastic action will not help matters any at all. We have a process, it will work. Please let the process work.

[Warren Verona]

Originally Posted By: Nova OOC

I'm telling you right now that it's a problem; you don't have to wait an hour. At just this moment, the 200X Bible forbids that. We're appending the 200X Bible to allow that. Be patient, please, help really is on the way. I promise. Drastic action will not help matters any at all. We have a process, it will work. Please let the process work.

Nothing is getting done. I don't even want to import a PC from 2010 but all I see is the same shit as yesterday. The same people locked in the same debate.

Then the poll... then a debate over the poll... then a flame war over the debate of the poll... then another poll...

I know you guys are trying your damnedest, and it's appreciated. But even if I were going to import a character anytime soon, I should not have to ask for permission to use my own intellectual property.

It's kinda sad... really.

[Nova OOC]

Dude, progress really is being made. This is only a discussion thread. One way or another, no matter what, there WILL be a vote posted in about 54 hours. That vote will run for 168 hours. At the end of that vote, we'll have our answer. I predict the answer will be "yes."

All the bluster in the world between now and then can neither slow nor speed that clock. Tick tick tick. . . that sound is inevitability. Patience, my friend.

[Warren Verona]

Then the discussion is pointless. I'll just wait until the vote and then kick back with Pizza and Doritos when White Rat decides to call it a farce and somehow twist that into a political debate.

See ya at the vote.

[Nova OOC]

Awesome possum. See ya then!

[Dr. Robert White]

Quote:

Then the discussion is pointless. I'll just wait until the vote and then kick back with Pizza and Doritos when White Rat decides to call it a farce and somehow twist that into a political debate.

I already posted that the transfer was going to happen, and that I had resigned myself to that fact. You want me to continue though, just keep pushing.

[Mr Fox]

WR, I see what you are saying, but there is a disconnect between what you perceive and what everyone else is perceiving on this matter. We are not voting on what the 2010 charter says, we are not telling 2010 how to run anything. We, the members of 200x are voting as to whether or not to allow ports of 2010 characters. Whether 2010 wants to say characters there are not allowed to leave is up to them.

What I'm saying is that this isn't an us vs. them situation. It is just us. The people wanting to port 2010 character are people on the 2010 boards. If a vote is called over there the charter is going to get changed. That's majority rule. Of course it would be pretty fuitile to tell the players that they can't leave.

The other thing is, even though the players wanting to port their characters are 2010 members, it still is not proper for us wearing our 200x hats to dictate anything to us wearing our 2010 hats what to do. We are just voting her whether to accept those who wish to port. It's up to 2010 to decide whether to allow them to leave. If you really want to see the charter there upheld as you see it, then you need to post there stating your objections.

[VileBill]

It's an immigration issue!

Okay, so we're America and we're voting on whether we want the poor, pitiful folks from...Australia (2010) come into our lush, green world and experience real life.

Life with Cherry Coke.

Life without Vegamite.

Life worth living.

[Nova OOC]

The funny thing is, if it's against the rules in 2010 to leave then I'll just leave anyway and allow the 2010 Moderator--whoever that is--to ban me from 2010.

And I'll smile the whole way.

[Praxis]

Against the rules to leave 2010, and the punishment for leaving is being banned from 2010. Umm.....

Rule #2 of the universe - If it makes sense, it's wrong

[SkyLion]

I would still like to see the subject addressed about the number of character slots. Not that I need a ton mind you...Im wrestling over which Id like to be my first. And as well Id like to note that I do understand a flood of new characters was considered a problem in 2010. However I would still like to see the issue addressed that as of now, people with 2018 characters get more of a presence on the board.

If at all novaly possible I would like to see some kind of effort to level the playing field for all especially in regards to N00bs...we do want fresh blood to find us right?

[Mr Fox]

Like I said. I've got one character and an empty slot. I don't really see the need for more, but I can understand that some might want more. I actually would rather see it the other way around and would love to see everyone held to x number of characters, reboots included. Unfortunately, that goes against the very point of this board being established, since it was in order to reboot 2018. Some people in 2018 had several characters, some had one or two, and some like me had none. Yes this does make for an imbalance between the folks that had a bunch of characters in 2018. What would we do though, now that the charter exists and characters have been introduced? We can't retroactively limit them and tell them to take their characters out of the fictions and opnet.

The opposite side of the coin would be to allow us Noobs to bring more characters in. As people have said, that was one of the things that killed 2010, a slew of new characters is a bad thing that saps the vitality out of the board.

I would propose that there should be a max number of characters per player regardless of the source. I'd say that number should either be 3 or 4, and never go beyond 5. If you want a new character you should retire an old one. If you can do justice to more than 5 characters and give them the time and effort that your fellow writers deserve then you freakin rock and I will stand in awe of your abilities and spare time.

I also like the fact that new characters are added over time. If we do set a limit I'd like to see the characters added slowly rather than flood the boards.

[The Story Guide]

I second Fox on this, in terms of a limit of total active characters.

[Charlotte]

On the Subject of Character Slots.

Going back to first principles, the slots are there to prevent a flood of characters. Adding new slots - even for a good reason - partially negates the purpose of having them. So I can see not wanting to add new slots.

The other side of it is this: people who've already used up slots not knowing what the status is of 2010, will feel cheated because they didn't know how imports would be handled, and setting aside a slot for them would alleviate problems. This is also sensible.

I personally find in favor of adding one more 'slot' for the initial year anyways, with the caveat that it should be used for 2010 reboots. My reasoning is this: since this slot is reserved for a pre-existing character, there is less data to assimilate which translates into less needed to keep up with the 200X forum. A limit on characters also means that there's less data to assimilate for the new player, who admittedly is going to have to assimilate quite a lot no matter what.

I'm open to suggestions. My priorities are:

- a system that is simple and easy to understand

- a system that is fair to both new players and old hands

- a system that allows people who wish to reboot 2010s an easy way of doing so.

[SkyLion]

Mr. McGee can you see the total slots being equal for reboots and n00bs alike as Fox suggested? That way there is some semblance of equality for new people?

I am in favor of staggered entry. Get one established before bringing in others unless they are somehow related (like Kazuo and Ausrine). That last sentance opens up potential for abuse though so it should be monitored carefully. ie no bringing in the Cletus family of redneck novas with 10 cousins and their offspring...

[Mr Fox]

McGee, I agree with the difficulties and that was part of what I was trying to get across. Messing with what is already established would be difficult to do without making someone feel like they got shorted. On the other hand, you have a situation now where some of the Noobs feel like they are at a disadvantage. This is a no win situation. Best we can hope to accomplish is to come to some agreeable spot in the middle. That's what my suggestion is, a limit to total number of active characters. Not a perfect solution, but perhaps a step in the right direction.

This could be combined with other options like giving everyone one extra slot for this year. I don't think that the extra slot should be a 2010 reboot slot only though, that would just widen the gap between the 'old hands' and 'noobs'.

[Seph OOC]

Originally Posted By: Mr Fox

I don't think that the extra slot should be a 2010 reboot slot only though, that would just widen the gap between the 'old hands' and 'noobs'.

I could be wrong, but I think what Mike was suggesting was that the extra slot would, in the case of those with 2010 ports, be used only to bring over a 2010 character, and new players would be eligible to use it on whatever. I could be wrong.

[Charlotte]

Seph, I was intending that it be used only to port 2010s - but on reflection that IS sort of unfair. I'm not sure a solution is viable without angering someone, sadly.