A question spawned from the sterilization discussion

[Lou Anne Burgess]

I've been wondering this for the past few months, certainly since Viva Las Vegas, but if I remember correctly I'd seen it come up before that.

With every theoretically Nova being exposed to the sterilization cocktail through one dose of Mox or Adrenocylin, and thus, at least as of 2008 very close to 100% of the Nova Population being affected, even with 8 extra years of drift for there to be people to not trust Utopia... how is it that there are relatively speaking so many Nova Children being conceived here? (other than the large terat sympathetic population)

Not to pick, but Wakinyan is a perfect example. He was willingly taken to a Rashoud facility. Standard procedure should have been for him to have received at least 1 dose of something with the cocktail in it. Since the agent is designed to survive against & work with Mega Stamina to turn nova germ cells into pathogens in the 'opinion' of the Nova's Immune System, his Health x2 and Mega Stamina should have had him good & sterile... Yet obviously he's not; a fact which Proteus may find out if they bothered to have someone obtain a sample from Las Vegas during the clean-up.

I know that from reading other profiles that some other characters have completely avoided Utopian/Triton pharmacology and thus could be completely unexposed. Additionally with Bounty's knowledge, other Terats could find out and work on curing themselves perhaps. It just seems there's a lot of reproduction in advance of the sterility being discovered & dealt with. (Which had been the assumption I was operating under until this topic came up.)

Can this be read as perhaps Proteus/Triton are starting to back off on the dosing of the nova drugs so as to start to distance themselves from the sterility conspiracy? It could work well with the scapegoat theory being advanced in the other discussion.

Back to my original question though... what's with all the nova children around here?

[Ptesan-Wi]

My understanding of the matter in Wakinyan's case is that he only had Health x1 when he went to the Rashoud facility - which would have rendered him immune to the mickey.

As for the others, it's a mixture of things. Dr. Troll has Health x1. Timeslip never went to Rashoud, living her life on the run from the moment of her nasty eruption. Carver has Health x1 (which is how she survived all that time in the rubble of Ibiza). If I recall correctly, Long's family was culturally disinclined to take him to a Rashoud facility. Neil Preston has some major Bio-Manipulative powers. Slattern has a level of body self-awareness that is off the scale. Clark's parents are Terats who may have taken advantage of Bounty's services (and who certainly kept their children away from Rashoud facilities). Thoughtwave isn't a nova at all (and as a psiad, all the nova-specific drugs do exactly zilch for and to her). Etc., etc.

It should also be kept in mind that, by and large, the folks at N!Prime aren't Utopians. Most of the characters that gather at this board are either independants (with perhaps a few closeted Aberrants in the mix) and Terats, with a very, very few Utopians in the mix. And there's plenty of sterile novas here; of mine, Sandcaster is barren, The Crusader shoots blanks, Cassandra Foster will be forever without child (though her sterility has nothing to do with the mickey), and Brother Jacob - even though he thinks himself "purged of the demon" - is sterile as well. Only Timeslip and Thoughtwave can have children (and as noted above, Thoughtwave isn't even a nova).

[David 'Dr. Troll' Smith]

As a general rule, PCs are the exceptions to everything, so it's no shock that they are over represented in that group.

It's also important to note several of the PCs had kids before they erupted. Multigate fits into that catagory, and although he signed on with DeVries rather than PU, I've always assumed Project Pro has a spy or something with DV which slips them the micky there.

the folks at N!Prime aren't Utopians

Troll is the exception to that which proves the rule.

I've also always assumed that the tabloid press has routinely been filled with 'stories' of the 'love children' by various members of T2M. Three or so of those a year combined with Doc Troll's kid make it hard to believe Utopians are steril.

[Dorothy Roberts]

Individually, it is due to unique circumstances. Collectively, it is due to players' habits of using out-of-character information (regardless of whether they intend to or not). A lot of people here have, if you'll excuse the term, excuses for why they're still fertile. Also, a bunch of the character concepts used on this board STEM from nova reproduction.

Timeslip showed up and was almost immediately pregnant.

Clark comes from a Terat family.

Dr. Troll was made to be an exception to many rules.

I'm not criticizing. In fact, I'm glad that there's as much variety in 'excuses' as there is. If everyone was fertile simply because they errupted with the standard set of powers that allowed it (Health x2, by the way), that would be both boring and suspicious. But the characters here lead interesting lives, even for novas. Because that's fun.

In other words: Nothing to see here. Move along.

[Doctor Nova Madigan]

Flicker's fertile at the moment, since she never went to a Rashoud for testing, but she's carrying around four Mox and Adrenocillin autoinjectors which Neil gave her which may or may not be tainted with the mickey.

GMoT is sterile because of the extreme body changes she underwent while erupting.

[Fortune's Son]

A fourth example from ancient Prime history with attendent excuse: the elite Jack Chance also known as Fortune conceived a child with the terat Harvester called Graveyard Jill by virtue of Luck. The theory was since sperm count isn't zero, eggs occassionally escape destruction by the body's immune system and the odds against successful impregnation aren't completely impossible then Luck would be the main ingredient as it makes unlikely events possible to the point of inevitablility. Gaia Primus Chance was borne from their union eleven months later. Then they had to wait another four months for the quantum egg to hatch.

They call her Gai.

[Wakinyan]

Quote:

Originally posted by Lou Anne Burgess:
his Health x2 and Mega Stamina should have had him good & sterile

Very much the opposite actually. The Health enhancement clearly states that it allows the Nova to resist the sterility cocktails. Wakinyan has had that ability since the day he erupted. He is sort of the ultimate ideal of "life will find a way" as Ian Malcolm so eloquently put it.

[David 'Dr. Troll' Smith]

As I recall, Health x1 automatically reduces the effect of poisons and the like. As the Sterility drug is presumably a level 2 effect, Mega-Stamina 2 + Health would make you immune without a die roll, but M-Stamina 1 + Health would do much the same with a die roll.

Troll's baseline self had issues with his health and with drug addiction. He fits the profile quite well for someone who would, and did, become a stamina brick. He's also an example of Mega-Int being more useful in RL than M-Strength.

Health x2 does the same thing but also grants the ability to turn the power off. Which raises the possibility of someone allowing the Sterility Drug to work since they think they are taking only Andies or whatever.

On a side note, the abby fan book "The New Flesh" is going to come out with lots of stuff on this subject.

[Dorothy Roberts]

Oh, sorry for the confusion. I guess I mis-remembered.

[Neil Preston]

Neil didn't go to the Rashoud facility during his eruption. His father purposely kept him away from the drugs.

The drugs Flicker has are not "infected".

Preston was sterilized, but had a flash of insight that "Utopia" was "poisoning" him during his eruption and has had a hate of for them ever since.

Preston was able to stop Selena from being sterilized. Crusader (not The Crusader of WCK fame) was immune at eruption. Virgil is sterile. Aguilar is sterile but has childern from prior to his eruption.

Jager never went to a Rashoud facility and is fertile. Now his Jager-Manliness renders the Jager-Bomb to any puny Cocktail.

Vali's Mother kept him away from Rashoud facilities due to a (perhaps) healthy dose of paranoia. He is fertile.

TeleRhyde is sterile. He was a good little nova and went to the Rashoud facility like he was supposed to.

Doc Aeon is sterile and glad of it. All novas should be sterilized as they are, or will be, a threat to mankind and obliterate the Earth.

Stormwarden isn't sterile and has never gone to a Rashoud facility. She is now immune due to years living out in the elements. Her only problem is that she wants to have Sandcaster's child.

[Gypsy]

Well, YT, Alice and Vangaurd can have children.

Of all of my characters, the only ones that would greatly change due to this coming out would Be Alice and Ezra. Teh rest well have their views of Utopia.

[Vixen]

Vixen is sterile, but not due to the drugs - she just can't carry a child to term. Her eruption fixed most every injury in her crippled body, but she had more or less made her peace with not having children so that was one thing that went unfixed.

She's still at piece with it - Mitch, less so, but adoption's always an option...

[Erin 'Stellar' Donovan]

Well, supposing the 'cocktail' is still being used by clinics in late 2015, Stellar would be sterile.

[GDP_ST]

Procyon is fertile, thanks to Bounty.

Incidentally, he knows in vague terms about the sterility cocktail, but keeps schtum about it because A)He's not sure who is wholly responsible for it, and doesn't buy into guilt by association and B)Isn't willing to see World War 3 kick off due to mass hysteria and rage.

[Sakurako Hino]

Sakurako hasn't been taking the drugs, and her recent changes have increased her immunity to such drugs anyways. She is fertile now, although she hasn't had any interest in breeding with anyone. As for her reaction... would unmitigated rage be appropriate?

Origami... She had been taking the said drugs, so she is infertile. Once the news got out (if it did)... whoo boy. Riot act.

DigiGeist regenerates and recovers too easily from most things, and he probably isn't firing blanks either. He'd quietly keep his displeasure at the fact that there are Novas who had been made sterile.

[Typhoon]

Ty was brought to a Rashoud Facility pretty early on by his superiors and received the cocktail and is therefore not surprisingly sterile.

[Fortune's Son]

Quote:

Originally posted by Typhoon:
... and is therefore not surprisingly sterile.

GASP!

[Hugin]

Hugin-Sterile. Erupted in 2008 former Utopian. Way sterile.

Slattern-Fertile. Erupted in 1999 never got the cocktail early on and since has developed Healthy along with an absurdely high MStamina.

Great Monster C-Sterile, not that it really matters.

Ultimax-Sterile.

Gerald Haney- Sterile and former Utopian so really, really sterile.

Lemmy Chillmeister-Not sterile with MStam with Healthy.

[kestrel404]

Alchemist - Not sterile thanks to a taylor-made invulnerability (He errupted with a broad-spectrum invulnerability to drugs or anything else that altered his body chemistry). This is unlikely to matter.

Dorothy - Not sterile because Al is paranoid of Utopia & Rashoud facilities in general, as well as capable of producing his own supply of mox & adrenocilin. Proteus may try to do something about this, but the opportunity hasn't presented itself.

Mike - Hasn't even errupted yet.

[Login]

Hmm...

Emily: Immune, she's a MSta monster with Health and Regen.

Login: Never touched a Rashoud facility, hasn't needed to take drugs.

Hoshiko: Super-sterile, has needed to take huge amounts of drugs and is totally unsurprising physically

Arcángel: Is T2M, sperm count: nada.

Fae: Few people even know she's a nova. Hasn't taken drugs.

Mutagen: his eruption made him paranoid. Hasn't gone near any official facilities of any kind. Not that anyone would want to procreate with his ugly mug.

God, I seem to have a good percentage of Utopia-avoiding paranoids. It wasn't on purpose, I swear.

[Soames]

I figure mox and andies are the nova equivalent of Tylanol and Advil. If I take asparin IRL then Soames has taken mox for headaches or andies when he needed a boost or to get really focused. What else is a nova going to take when regular drugs wash right out of their system in a couple of minutes. So if you look at one bottle in a hundred being doctored, been a nova for a while, and only need one mickey to be sterile then he's got no kids in his future.

And yeah he hates Utopia but its because he did time from the purge of organized crime. He hates what they did to him and how they did it. They broke the Rules and act like they are all angels when he knows better. If Soames has got anything to say about it then every last one of those smiling bastards is going to pay with blood. This would be just a more personal reason to do it and do it sooner instead of later.

[David 'Dr. Troll' Smith]

Quote:

Soames: I figure mox and andies are the nova equivalent of Tylanol and Advil. If I take asparin IRL then Soames has taken mox for headaches or andies when he needed a boost or to get really focused. What else is a nova going to take when regular drugs wash right out of their system in a couple of minutes. So if you look at one bottle in a hundred being doctored, been a nova for a while, and only need one mickey to be sterile then he's got no kids in his future.

Oh, it's a lot worse than that. If I were Theis, I'd put an agent or two at the other places were novas go, and *especially* where they take drugs.

Even if you've never gone to the clinic, changes are good if you've had an Amp-well, then they got you.

[Soames]

Quote:

Originally posted by David 'Dr. Troll' Smith:
Even if you've never gone to the clinic, changes are good if you've had an Amp-well, then they got you.

The nova version of Tylanol and Advil remember. You don't go to a clinic to get a bottle of Mox or Andi. You order the stuff online or make a toll free call and it gets delivered in a few hours. A day tops. Courtesy of those caring peeps working for Uncle Utopia.

I like the Amp Well idea though. Thetis puts moles everywhere else. The XWF. Devries. The Directive. The Windy City Knights.

[David 'Dr. Troll' Smith]

Adding it to Amp Wells also lets PU claim they weren't the only ones fooled.

[Doctor Nova Madigan]

Adding it to Ampwells also hoses the characters who had avoided Mox and Adrenocilin based on OOC knowledge.

In other words, I like this idea. It f--ks Flicker, because she's had Ampwells, but I'm okay with that.

[Hugin]

It also isn't supported anywhere within canon. I don't think there was ever even the suggestion that the sterility cocktail has other avenues. Considering that ampwells were made in house by the Amp Room what does that say about the folks who ran the Amp Room?

[Soames]

It says the Bartender did it, in the pit, with poison. Colonel Mustard is finally off the hook...

[David 'Dr. Troll' Smith]

Quote:

Hugin:It also isn't supported anywhere within canon. I don't think there was ever even the suggestion that the sterility cocktail has other avenues.

Not directly, but it is supported indirectly. Consider that Project Pro *must* have had some kind of program to sterilize the novas that it missed. Either that or they were willing to live with someone realizing only utopian novas were steril (and cannon tells us it wasn't that easy). Then all we have to do is think about what such a program would have looked like.

Quote:

Hugin:Considering that ampwells were made in house by the Amp Room what does that say about the folks who ran the Amp Room?

That they didn't know, just like the PU doctors giving the andies?

Or perhaps it says that one of the mystery ingrediants of amp-wells that lets it cut through nova metabolisums is based on PU technology? Actually I'd be suprised if it wasn't. If you are trying to put together something that makes novas high, then the obvious place to start is with nova medicines.

[Fortune's Son]

I think necessity is the mother of invention. The majority of novas on this board grew up in a society where being medicated was a way of life. Everyone takes something at some time. And yet (GASP!) we have a statistical anomoly in the number of people that somehow escaped this indoctrination and decline the only two legal medications that can do something for a nova despite their metabolisms.

Now why do you suppose that is?

Were I an ST, which I am not, then yes the sterility cocktail would be in Ampwells. For that matter, the cocktail would be dormant in every suit of eufiber sold on open or black market. As I said, necessity is the mother of invention. If people want to play out of character information they are most assuredly welcome to do so provided they understand they're not kidding anyone.