opnet [OpNet] Practical and Ethical Advice Sought

[Nevyn]

I have recently found myself in a rather uncomfortable situation and was wondering if any of those who pay attention to this forum could give me some advice on what to do.

Unlike some other people, my 'talents' are all in a rather limited area. I can draw extremely well, accurately, and quickly. The part which is unusual is the fact that my drawings have a tendency to step out out of the paper and into full sized life.

I am sorry if this seems like boasting, but I thought that some background information on the problem at hand would be nessisary.

Now, normally those that I draw are roughly as I envisioned them in regards to everything except their appearance which always matches the drawing I made. With one recent drawing I have hit a big problem.

She is begging me to not to let her 'die' and almost hysterical about the matter.

This has never been a problem for me before, those that I have drawn having come to life and stayed for almost a week before fading away. I am unsure of why Sue is different, perhaps my mind had wandered at the wrong moment, but the fact that she has enough self-awareness to ask makes me more than a little reluctant to simply let her vanish.

Can anyone here give me any advice or suggestions on what to do with this matter? I do not feel comfortable doing nothing, but am uncertain what could be done.

As can be imagined, time is fairly critical in this matter so prompt replies would be appreciated.

[Wizard]

Joesph, thank you for sharing your ability with us, that information is important. Now you need to tell us more about 'Sue'. When did she come to you and under what circumstances? What exactly were you envisioning when you assisted in her arrival here? What is she like?

From the information you provided so far the answer is very simple. One would think it has already occurred to you and been found to be unpalatable. Now tell the rest of the story.

[ 02-17-2002: Message edited by: Elizabeth ]

[Nevyn]

I drew Sue two days ago now, in the evening when I was attempting to relax. Drawing has always been an escape for me, but recently I have been drawing almost entirely for a reason and never simply sketching whatever came to mind.

In a way, you could say that I was doddling but I had allowed myself to go a little further than that. I had begun with a simple pencil sketch which developed into something which I inked and then, of course, the colouring was the next logical step...

The idea which had started the initial sketch was a simple one, inspired by some Japanese manga that I had seen some time ago. A girl, a young lady, with just the slightest hint of a animal nature hinted at by a pair of cats ears perched on the top of her head. Something in a comic style, completely different from the realistic drawings that had been occupying me earlier that day.

Brown eyes, large and expressive, looking out of the page at the viewer and hinting at vulnerablity. Short dark hair in a page boy cut, not quite tomboyish. Hands clasped about each other at her throat while her shoulders are still bare. Her head tilted upwards slightly to look back at me, the view obscured below that level as though by a white mist...

I had finished the drawing before I thought things through, it holding the almost luminous quality of reality to it despite the way that the style exagerated such things beyond the norm.

Without thinking twice about it, I did as I had done so often before and touched the picture. It rippled for a moment and then Sue reached up, her hands leaving the page to hold it's sides as she pulled herself out of two dimensions and into the real world.

This was something I had seen many times before and nothing seemed unusual to my eyes although I did mental castigate myself for wiping the drawing by bringing it to life instead of simply keeping it.

Nothing seemed that unusual about Sue initially except that I had to fetch some clothes for her, having not envisioned or drawn them in. I told her where she could stay in my house and showed her the various utilities, introducing her to the few others whom of my own devicing who were currently in the building.

In personality, which I had not thought of before that point, she seemed to be slightly shy and vaguely embaressed by having to ask questions but was friendly and playful. A slightly cautious kitten might be an accurate analogy.

It wasn't until just this afternoon that anythind odd occured and that happened when she witnessed Akane simply fade out of existance. It was then that she asked what had happened.

This, in itself, was unusual as most of those I create seemed to instinctively know how long they will remain. Sue, on the other hand, apparently had no idea and promptly begged me not to let the same happen to her.

It took me a few hours to calm her down, and a few more for myself to admit that I was stumped and resort to the OpNet.

Is this sufficient information, Elizabeth?

[Jager]

It would be easy to look at Sue as nothing more than a quantum construct powered by your imagination, for that is what she is. But is she more than that?

A wise woman once said, we are all the stuff of stars. We are all energy, brought together by the universe for some purpose we do not fully understand.

If you do nothing, which is your right, Sue will die in a few days. Perhaps it is in your power to alter that fate. Have you ever attempted to 're-invigorate' one of your creations before? Did it work? If so, I suggest that you stop drawing sentiant beings for your own sanity's sake.

If you can't help her, I suggest contacting James Meehan on this board or I can have a Quantum mechanic named Alagory contact you. Dr. Sydney Holland is the foremost expert in the field, but he has been missing for the past few months.

Let me know what you decide to do.

[Hugin]

Mr. Weber your new found friend is only a certain amount of energy whizzing around in a specific pattern. Her sentience is real only so far as you are willing to accept it. Her personality is the result of a combination of certain quantum imperitives and reactions to her environment.

Treat her as you will. The only responsibility that you have is that which you decide to accept.

However.

You are only energy whizzing around in a specific pattern. Your sentience is only as real as those around you decide to allow for.

Your personality is the result of certain biological imperitives and reactions to your environment.

Food for thought.

You are responsible for what you bring into this world. You are responsible for your creations and you are responsible to your creations.

From your experience, how long does your friend have?

[Wizard]

Almost but not quite.

Here's the big finals; how do you feel about Sue? If the situation hadn't come up about her lifespan how would you have felt about her approaching expiration? And does her reaction change how you feel on the matter?

[ 02-18-2002: Message edited by: Elizabeth ]

[Dr. Arcturus]

Mr. Weber, I belive I can help you, having had experience in creating life on several occasions.

Now, without having taken a diagnostic of your particular Quantum signature (unless you want me to. It only taken a minute), I can only give you the benefit of my experience.

This "construct", as these philistines are calling Sue, is as much a living, breathing being as you are. Yes, she is constituted and bound entirely of Quantum energy, but I can say the same for many Novas in the world, if not a few on this board.

Now, having said that, I belive you can save her. Your art is obviously the channel your erruption took for your power of creation. Given that focus, I belive you can maintain Sue. It will take an act of tremendous and conscious will, perhaps even my help or any other matter/energy manipulator, but you need to focus your own energies into the framework for Sue you still have in your mind and focus on "tuning down" her Quantum resonance. The energies of your creations exist as a state of excited energy contained and maintained by your subconscious mind. By tuning down the resonance of your creations , you can effectively stabalize these beings.

At least, this is my best educated hypothesis. Without the benefit of scanning your own signature and, if at all possible, those of your other creations (espeacially Sue), I can not be completely certain.

A few questions: How did you errupt?

What was your first creation?

[Nevyn]

I am very glad to have recieved four replies on this matter and will try to answer each in turn below. Some answers I give are mentioned only once though, rather than being repeated for each person, so those reading may wish to read everything rather than merely that which is addressed to them.

I would like to say that I do appreciate those of you who are offering advice to me and Sue has also asked me to pass on her gratitude to you as well.

Jaeger,

Typically, unless I push myself to the point that it is uncomfortable, anything that I draw remains manifest for roughly eight days with a few existing into a ninth and so I can only assume that Sue will exist for that long. That would leave her with five or six days remaining.

Previously I have not attempted to 'reinvigorate' that which I have drawn, but have instead drawn them afresh if it became nessisary. There seemed to be at least some continuty between 'versions' of those I manifested since some would recall conversations that I had had with them or things such as where the tea bags were in my kitchen.

I will think about your offer of help and will contact you privately within the next two days unless I find a solution in that time.

Mr. Meehan,

I am aware of the responcibilities that I have, that is one of the reasons that I have asked for advice on this matter. Even if Sue was not as real as a normal human being, it seems to me that it would not be fair to simple abandon her to her fear and the remorseless approach of her 'death' like a condemed person awaiting their execution.

I think that I have answered the last question you asked in my reply to Jaeger earlier in this message.

Elizabeth,

My feeling on Sue, if she had acted as others that I had drawn do and did, would have been like seeing a friend. Somebody whom I was familiar with and whom I could 'call in' to give me a hand if I didn't mind them staying for a few days. While some of those whom I have manifested have disagreed with me, one in particular who managed to use my credit card to sign up for far too many pornographic OpNet sites he was interested in, I do not think of them as random things that I have made. Each is individual. In Sue's case the fact that she is so scared of "going poof like that", to put it in her own words, means that I will at least respect that view and see what can be done. I do intend, however, to be more careful in future about those who I draw.

Quantum Promise,

I may not understand some of the technicalities of what you seem to mean, but if you do believe that you can help then I would be most grateful. One thing I feel that I should point out is that I am not aware of any maintance which my mind might be doing to allow Sue's continued existance. It is an effort when I manifest someone, but after that it has never seemed to be any sort of drain on me.

The exact circumstance around my erruption and my first creation are rather sensitive on a personal level, but I will give you it stripped of some details. I was upset, feeling abandoned and alone, and just began to draw as a kind of catharsis. I wanted somebody who would listen to me, somebody who would be there for me, anybody who mean that I was not alone, and drew a picture as an idealization of that...

I found myself staring at one of the best pictures I had done up to that point and it was as though I was being mocked by her due to the impossibility of her being real. I just looked at the picture for a moment and then there was a burning pain deep inside my head.

The next thing that I was aware of, I had my head cradled in someone's lap and opened my eyes to see a face which I had just drawn. A face which had come purely out of my imagination but had now been brought to life.

Does that answer your question?

[Dr. Arcturus]

It answers my question to the extent of its usefulness, yes.

My next question: Would you allow me to perform a scan of your Quantum signature? It would give me a great deal of insight as to the nature of these manifestations, which would be supremely helpful, should you wish to maintain Sue.I must warn you: In order to completely compliment the scan, it is necessary to do a full telepathic probe of Sue, if only to assess the extent of her sentience. A cursory scan of your brain would also be needed to determine how her neural pathways and abstract psychochemical reactions compare to yours. I am capable of doing all of the scanning, and am willing to do it at no charge to you.

[ 02-18-2002: Message edited by: Quantum Promise ]

[Wizard]

Joseph, it would seem that the full realization of your power has blossomed, possibly before you were ready to see it. You are now perceiving the responsibility that comes with having the power of a god.

In your previous cases you crafted these beings for specific reasons and they always met your expectations. Even if their specific actions were not always what you had anticipated.

This ability you wield is not a separate entity from yourself, like some playful genie. In a very real sense it is you and as distinctive as a fingerprint for a baseline. Which brings us back to 'Sue'. Sue is different in that you had no conscious expectations. She acts differently than the others because you created her differently from the others. And no one, absolutely no one, can tell you what is going to happen next.

Why? One hopes this doesn't bore you...

In your moment of eruption there was a brief period of time, almost too short to measure, when you were consciously part of the greater universe. Most of us don't really remember that moment but it's part of us and we share that with you. In each case, the moment of infinite possibility is colored by expectations and ego. That's why two novas with the same power aren't normally able to work together directly. Regardless of how similar the effects may be the means by which they achieve them are completely different.

Without understanding you, Joseph, none of us is able to do more than offer generalities regarding what you are capable of. In the case of Mr. Meehan or Doctor Holland these generalities are more insightful than most, but they are still generalities and educated guesses.

Sue has a given span that was determined when you created her. Can you stay that outcome? Without knowing you personally this is only a guess but... I would say it's possible.

The real question is should you try?

That seems to be the question you're really asking. Should you try regardless of whether you might suceed or fail?

Ultimately it comes down to you, Joseph. Having the power of a god means having the potential to do anything, NOT everything. My advice is to spend the time allotted with her wisely. You're your own best guide on what decisions there are to be made and why. You will know what you need to do when the time comes. Whether you succeed or fail isn't relevant.

Welcome to the next level, Joseph. I don't mean to scare you but responsibility is where most wash out.

[ 02-18-2002: Message edited by: Elizabeth ]

[Dr. Arcturus]

I think I could be of a GREAT deal of help to you.

It is within my power to create life. Human life. NOVA life, at times, though not often. It is entirely possible for me to use my own mastery of Quantum as a medium to transfer everything Sue is into a living being that completely compliments her signature. Essentially, everything Sue is now, in an energetic sense, would be her life force, mind, and personality. I would still need to run my scans.

One more thing: If I do this for you, I will NEVER do it for you again. Sue will live out her mortal life. A human lifespan. She will die one day. And I will let her. My offer stands, but with that stipulation.

[ 02-18-2002: Message edited by: Quantum Promise ]

[Vile Bill]

Hey there partner, don't mean to be stickin' mah snoot in where you don't want it. That's why I ain't said shit till now. I ain't one of those touchy feely novas who are all about talking and advice and crap. I fight and I fight damn well. But son, I just wanted to warn you away from this Quantum Promise yahoo.

See, I don't know if you've been readin' up on everybody here. We got ourselves a nice assortment of folk. Some of em are downright good folk. That Jager, he's a good 'un. He's a might soft, but he's regular people. We this hot little filly Ashnod (honey, I've seen pictures and you are a twister!), now she ain't just a good lookin piece of trim, but somethin' real special in the Teragen I guess. Smart lady from what I hear. And we got that smartass son of a bitch Prodigy. Just tell the egghead to shut the fuck up, he ain't worth a fart in a tornado no how. Now, like I been sayin' we gots all sorts of folks here. Well, ol QP, word is he's just nuts. Thinks he's god or sumpthin like that. So, you take care of your little filly, you do right by her and everything will be ok. Take the advice my momma gave me, ain't no good ever come from fiddlin with the crazy.

Take care Hoss.

[Ashnod]

Mr. Weber,

While I don't feel comfortable offering you any advice on Sue, I will offer this bit for the future.

If you are unable to grant these creations any kind of permanent existence, do not fashion any more that may even remotely possess any degree of self-awareness, even if this self-awareness is granted only through your wishes.

Watching them fade, pleading for more life, will drive you insane, eventually. Or, you will become jaded to them, and this too, will transform you in ways you probably don't wish to be changed in.

My advice to you is to cease drawing living beings for a while. Practice on inanimate objects, or beings whose life span would be measured in a handful of days naturally, such as certain species of insects. Continue to do this until you have control over when a drawing animates.

Regardless, I would still caution you against creating another such as Sue anytime in the near future.

Good Luck

[Guest]

Joseph, m´boy; you should listen up to what old Billyboy has to say on this matter. He has a few valid points, beneath all o´that hillbilly lingo; Elites have a refreshingly sober perspective on things.

Finished? Okay, here´s old Nimrod´s view on things, directly delivered fresh-baked from my heart via the Opnet to you. Enjoy, Joseph:

Your little Cutey Honey is little more than a manifestation of your own desire. Maybe you´re just aching for somehitng doe-eyed to fuck sily, maybe you feel like pulling a Shining Knight and rescue her from a fate worse than death. In either case, get your head outta your ass and smell the guacamole.

There is no spoon. Or in this case, there is no semi-furry vulnerable princess begging for you to save her cute little ass. There´s just a loose buindle o´ wishes for you to exploit.

Haven´t got what it takes, sonny? Then go along with the (uncharacteristically soft) advice from our old miss Scary Skank Ashnod and quit. Pull something over your head and pity yourself, because no one´s there to do it for you.

(Apart, of course, from dear old Jager; he seems to have a few crocodile tears to spare for everyone, as long as he gets sufficient coverage.)

Enjoy, and please come again.

[Guest]

Quote:

<Nimrod> on his soapbox said:
There is no spoon.

What a tool.

Another quantum powered goof living his life through baseline entertainment. Especially that piece of trash.

Do what feels right Joe. We could get into all the moral and legal issues but that has nothing to do with anything of importance on this one. Personally, I agree with Bill; treat her right and go from there. No one guaranteed a happy ending but that's life. Play the cards you're dealt and make the best of.

Oh, and Vile Bill...? The next party is in Houston. Me and a couple of the folks are thinking about flying in to show Angel Micky's retarded step children what the wrath of god looks like up close and personal.

It's not paying job but it's gonna be a party and a half. I won't even bitch about the two weeks it took to scrape off your black mucous after that dust up in Nigeria. You sucker punched me but it was a sweet delivery. I look forward to the payback.

[Fortune's Son]

Piece of trash opnet terminals!

Just wanted to make certain 'Rod knew who it is that thinks he's a movie lovin' waste of flesh that needs to live his life instead of watching it. Course you knew who was talking to you, right Bill?

Hope you can make the time for Houston.

[ 02-19-2002: Message edited by: Jack Chance ]

[Guest]

Aww. You´re completely right; silly old me. I guess I´ll recreate my own Nova-style entertainment by tracking you down and make you scream like a school girl.

Be seeing you, precious.

[Fortune's Son]

Do that sweet stuff.

Man! I do so love fresh meat thinking it's all big and bad.

[Nimrod]

Well, Jack... can I call you Nancy?Seriously; was the process of watching that old flick such a trauma to you that I managed to tick off your delicate little sensibilities so bad? Or was I being bad again by stating the blatantly obvious? I can understand if the incredible Cartoon Boy would get pissed off - after all, he´s a babe in the woods - but your reaction is somewhat confusing to this old, daft, outdated-entertainment junkie.

Feel free to update me. And don´t you worry; I´m not going to go "Nimrod SMASH" all over your cute little ass because you act tough on a message board.

[Fortune's Son]

Nope.

I just don't trust anybody that pulls their analogies or examples from the movies, Holly or Bollywood. Why would anybody take seriously a word said after such a putrid line? Especially a line taken from that piece-o-trash [tm]. People have been quoting it for years like were some kind of religious experience. Now here we all are, walking talking powers straight from myth and legend and what's your input....

"There is no spoon..."

It's purely disappointment in your lackluster conversation I assure you. Wish I could say it was something deep or angsty but like the man said, sometimes deep is just barely deep enough to step in. Makes a heckuva smell to track around but that's all.

Thanks for forgoing the Nimrod Smash line though. You have my gratitude for restraining yourself.

[Nimrod]

Oh-kay. I see the problem now, Nancy; it was silly old me making that odd phrasing that confused the hell out of the big, bad murder machine.

Y´see, I really meant to tell Comic Boy that his issue was not one of morality, but of self-delusion - y´know, much like when you fancy yourself a tough guy - and that he better wise up and see his precious little princess for the soulless wet dream that she was.

That clear things up?

Fuck, I absolutely hated that piss-poor excuse of a "classic" Nova, but I´m not going off on a tangent to rip the head off of anyone who quotes it. Why dontcha, y´know, take a stress pill and relax?

Take my word for it, Lucy; you need to get laid.

[ 02-19-2002: Message edited by: Nimrod ]

[Fortune's Son]

Nope again, 'Rod. It was just you being unable to express yourself except through a tired bit of eye candy made by baselines for baseline consumption before the real goods arrived. And if that's what you wanted to tell him then next time you might want to forego the cute bullshit and give it to him straight. He's at least asking the question straight and, aside from you not caring for what he considers a valid question, didn't deserve your excuse for witty sarcasm.

Thanks for the murder-machine riff but not every one of us slugs it out in Africa through the mud and the blood. I don't consider myself a tough guy, just one that can stand up for himself. And string a few words together in answer without feeling the need to puff up and dance like a baseline monkey to the PU organ grinder.

Stick around though. One of these days the bad old dark knight, Divis Mal wannabe, will drop back in and you two can exchange your witty sarcasms to the rest of our eternal delight.

And when a man calls me by a pet name it better be Linda.

Cya in the funny pages boy wonder.

[ 02-19-2002: Message edited by: Jack Chance ]

[Nimrod]

Damn, Edna; you could hurt a boy´s feelings acting all superior like that. However, it does warm my heart to see those motherly feelings of yours for Comic Boy.

In respect for this soft-lense moment, I´ll stop hijacking his thread. I´ll be happy to start up another one in case you feel the need to exhange more light-hearted quips. Hell, I can just post my taste in old classic movies, and you can bash ´em all. If you hated The Matrix as much (which is odd in my mind; I consider it a great source of pure slapstick joy), I wonder how you´re going to feel about my love for The bridges of Madison County?

[Wizard]

What interesting additions to the thread.

[ 02-19-2002: Message edited by: Elizabeth ]

[Fortune's Son]

Bridges? Now there was a work of art to be sure...

Naw, but thanks for the offer anyway. I gotta fly out soon on a job. When I get back we can trade insults on something or other.

You take as good as you give. Watch out for crunchies, Rod.

[ 02-19-2002: Message edited by: Jack Chance ]

[Nimrod]

´Care, Linda.

Sorry, redhead lady. I´ll behave.

[Wizard]

No, don't be sorry.

As colorful as some of what you two said may have been, you both managed to say something in answer to Joseph.

What do you think, Joseph? Nimrod, Vile Bill and Chance all brought up points that are valid from a certain perspective. What does your heart tell you?

[Jager]

Why am I beginning to feel that all emotional reactions are pointless? Isn't it all just California Dreaming?

Joseph & Sue, are you still with us?

[Fortune's Son]

Pointless like a cold drink, a hot date and good meal maybe. You can live without but what kind of life is that?

That's why I'm interested in seeing which way Joe decides on this one. The easy solution looks obvious but like the lady said; none of us really know whats going to happen. We're all just theorizing here. Joseph's actually hanging out where the rubber meets the road.

Maybe it is pointless in the big picture like 'Rod implied but doing what you believe isn't. It may not pay well or win popularity contests but it's never pointless.

My opinion anyway.

[Nevyn]

Umm.. this is Sue here. Joe can't talk right now, he's in bed and nto feeling too good about things. He was trying to do something with some new drawings and kinda fell over this morning so we've put him up to bed.

The others are worried about him, Sage keeps on trying to make me feel better about all this, but they don't seem to like me. They say that it's my fault, that i shouldn't say things that worry Joe.

Sorry, gotta go. The others say that Joe looks like he's going to wake up soon.

[Guest]

This is to both Sue and Joe.

Sue, I feel for you. I, like you, am a construct. Created from the quantum powered forces of my creator. I do not have your limited lifespan, at least, I believe I do not. If you are unable to continue existence I am sorry, it is my hope that you have some enjoyment in your time here. If you do disappear, please know and accept this. You have come from energy and energy can never be destroyed. Humans may argue about the existence of their soul, but you, your creation guarantees that there is an ephemeral part of you that will live on. And some day, perhaps return.

Joe, I hope that you are succesful. Creating such as you have done is a noble thing. Much more noble than some of the lagabouts on this board that feel their special circumstances enoble them. They bicker and fight between their petty distractions. Heed them no mind. You will do what is right, I trust you in that.

Good evening all.

[Fortune's Son]

Hey, Sue-girl.

Keep an eye on your man Joe and give a yell if you need some practical advice. Don't let your boy lay around for more than a day before yelling for help; that's too long for the juice back to come back.

Don't sweat the others. Joe didn't do anything he didn't want to do.

[Dr. Arcturus]

Sue,

Has Joe mentioned anything to you about what I have offered? All I need to do is a complete psychic scan on you and Joe, and then it becomes possible for me to try to fortify you. I can make you a living breathing being. Think about it.

Vile Bill,

I AM not CRAZY. I WAS suffering from a bout of TAINT. I realized what I had done and dissembled the reality I had created. It just wasn't right to allow this new reality to continue existing, considering the circumstaces under which it was created. Rest assured, though, my powers are MORE than sufficient to help Sue in the way I have described.

.... and you mispelled "Haus", you miscreant.

[ 02-20-2002: Message edited by: Quantum Promise ]

[Fortune's Son]

Actually, I'm pretty sure he meant Hoss not Haus. I take it you've never been graced by the presence of any red-necks? V.B. is the only man I've ever even heard of that actually knows the words to the theme song 'Bonanza'. You really are a complete wacko aren't you. Glad to know you got better though. Sorry to hear about the universe...

Susie, it takes all kinds to round out the world. This is an example of the kind that just want to help you, all they need is for you to believe and have faith... Not to mention a credit card number. Stick with Joe on this one, Susie-kat.

[ 02-20-2002: Message edited by: Jack Chance ]

[Nevyn]

Here are the amassed replies from myself the various people that posted on here since I last wrote on here.

Elizabeth,

I am not sure that I agree with you completely on this matter. If I had drawn Sue and made her real with the foreknowledge of her lifespan then it would be one thing. The fact that she seems to have expected a human lifetime and then been short changed on that alloted span is another entirely.

How would you appreciate it if your parent came up to you and said, "Oops! Sorry about this, but I made a mistake and your going to drop dead next week instead of living out your life. Hope you don't mind."

I do believe that I should try to help Sue even if the fear proves to be groundless. Some of my drawings have recalled previous times I manifested them so perhaps this entire problem might not be as it seems at first.

What I am finding to be the question is: Should I allow someone whom I am responsible for, in a very literal sense, suffer simply because I do not want to try?

Quantum Promise,

Your... offer is appreciated, but I must admit to a touch of doubt about your ability to fufil them. Some skeptical part of my mind keeps asking me what someone capable of creating a universe would be doing reading this message board.

Vile Bill,

Thank you for you vote of support in this matter and you advice does seem sensible enough. It is also good to hear from someone who is not having to dumb down their comments and advice to avoid risking those going straight over my head.

Ashnod,

Your practical advice for the future is greatly accepted, what you say seems not only feasible but the most sensible thing way to develop my ability. I will do my best to follow it, not manifesting any new drawings until I have developed a great degree of skill.

One thing that I was concidering is manifesting again those drawing who did not seem upset and questioning them about what they recall or what they feel about the situation. The reason I would risk this is that, as I might have mentioned elsewhere, certain manifestation seem to have a continuity of memory between occasions when they are in the 'real' world and this might be worth exploring.

May I ask your opinion on this course of action?

Nimrod,

I can see your point of view, but might I ask you one question in return? How do you know that anyone except yourself exists? I am assuming that here that if someone or something acts sentient as far as I can possibly tell then I should treat that person or thing as intelligent until some fact to dispute it comes to light.

Or, to put it in terms of your quotation, "If it look like a spoon, feels like a spoon, and you can eat pudding with it like a spoon, then why the hell don't I treat it like a spoon?"

Jack Chance,

Thank you for your support and vigours comments on this subject. I will try to let you know how things eventually turn out, but as yet things have not been that hopeful so far as I can tell.

As the one of the two of you who is more likely to listen to a reasonable request, would you mind taking your discussion with Nimrod about when and where grevious bodily harm will be inflicted to another area?

I do apprecaite your concern over my health though.

Jager,

Yes, we are both still hear. I appologise for my longer than planned silence, but I managed to have a slightly accident when attempting something as will be described below.

[Nevyn]

My appolgies for my silence. As Sue seems to have mentioned on here, I managed to virtually blow myself up when attempting to see if I could fortify a potted plant which I drew specifically for this attempt.

As is obvious, it did not work as I had expected and I now have the rather charred remains of the potted plant in the rubbish bin. The room still smells vaguely of smoke though.

A very small ammount of good did come of this though as I managed to pay more attention to how I manifest something that I usually do. It was oddly strange, like attempting to recall each muscle you use when winding up to throw a baseball, and words fail me for some of the sensations.

When I began to try to manifest the plant, it was like I was pushing something. Pushing the image I had in my mind onto and into the image that was on the paper itself. For a breif moment there was almost a connect and I could feel heat/light/wamrth? rush out from somewhere inside me, flooding into the design/outline? that I presented for it.

The connection was very short lived, short enough that it was hard enough to register properly, but I got a sense of something collapsing/cocooning/surrounding? what I was doing and it suddenly growing distant from me before the attachment was severed.

That went smoothly, but the attempt to 'fortify' it did not go well.

I kept in mind that the plant was an image as much as it had been on the page, reaching out to touch it as though I wished to bring any other image into reality. For a moment I could feel the connection there, but it was tinted? and tasted different. The surge went out and, rather than smoothly merging as I had half expected, skewed and splattered as though I was trying to aim the water from a hose pipe through a narrow appature.

From what the others tell me it made a lot of pretty lights and a rather loud bang , but I was not aware of that until they told me as I woke up with a throbbing head hours later.

[Nimrod]

Joseph, Joseph, Joseph; I try to be forthcoming and you go philosophical all over my ass. It is to be expected of an artist, I guess.

Why care?

If I like something just the way it is, then it´s a-okay with this one. If it gets in my way, I break it. If it spouts out cuddly-duddly shit, I piss on it. It´s really that simple.

Call it a momentary lapse of bastardness; just figured I´d lend a helping hand to the fresh-faced kid. If pretending that your little furry hentai princess is real makes you happy, then by all means go for it; have fun. Can´t see why you don´t deserve it.

[Elizabeth Rayne]

Wooo! I come back to this weirdness

If the other constructs you have made have retained their memories through redrawing then it is likely Sue will as well. This is a little risky however. If I were you I'd try to expand her life this time but if that fails if you redraw her were her in mind you should be able to reincarnate her so to speak.

One other thing ... please don't draw any imaginary novas. You probably couldn't make any but I doubt it's worth the risk.

Beth

[Dr. Arcturus]

I concur. Take it from me:

Creating Novas can be a rather painful experience in backlash.....

[Elizabeth Rayne]

Joseph, sorry I could have sworn your reply wasn't there when I posted. Anyway I don't know about Ashnoud but I think you should explore that idea.

Or if you aren't afraid of more explosions have you tried siphoning a creation into a new picture.