opnet [OpNet] Nova-Tissue Grafts

[Guest]

Has anyone here tryed grafting synthetic nova tissue onto non-novas? I've been having considerable success genetically-engineering mice to include Mazarin coils in their cellular structure, with varied results. Right now, I think I've got a synthetic MR Node graft that, when implanted in a baseline's brain and combined with a retrovirus of my own design, will raise the probability of an eruption by several orders of magnitude.

[Jager]

While I can think of several reasons why someone would do this, what are yours? Also, from what I understand of nova physiology, aren't you basically killing the baselines that don't erupt?

[Hugin]

Now now now Jager, you're not playing fair. It's not nice to point out a scientist's *early* failures. They are to be expected and we learn from them. Very good though at noticing it is what a researcher does not say that points out the weak points in any study.

I do wonder though at the value of these experiments. Are you trying to elevate baselines? Or are you trying to enhance Nova numbers? Have you taken into account other genotypes that we may not know about yet? Jager, myself and others have come across non quantum manipulating individuals who are still able to produce some remarkable effects. What about them?

[Guest]

Jager - The node and retorvirus shouldn't kill the implantee, at least in the majority of cases. The tissue is grafted into the brain via a Neural-Seed system of my own creation, then connected to the rest of the brain using a transgenic neural alignment pathway. The retrovirus changes the rest of the subject's genetic structure to ensure that in the case of an eruption, the subject won't experience a massive, violent, and fatal seizure. Once the dormant MR-node has been implanted, the subject is given small doses of stimulants in safe quantities to induce eruption. Subjects who don't respond to the treatment shouldn't have any problems, save that they'll be carrying the dormant node around for the rest of their lives (or until it is removed). Once I've completed the final preparations for automated implantation, I plan to use the procedure on myself. I won't use any process on a human that I wouldn't use on myself.

Meehan: I'm not entirely sure what these other individuals you are speaking of are. Perhaps they have the theoretical full-brain farahcyte spread? That would both prevent the detection of the node itself and make it much more difficult to detect the quantum signature of quantum-manipulation. My reason for attempting to induce eruption in non-latent baselines should be fairly obvious: enhancing the quality of human life. The ability to make responsible, valuable members of society superhuman in the respects needed to enhance their performance would have vast benefits.

[Guest]

Amnexus,

I believe Prodigy is speaking of another evolutionary offshoot of mankind. They manipulate the quantum universe on a Sub-Quantum level. They are what most people might call psychics. They don't have Nodes and their "Psychic Resonance" interferes with quantum energy production and manipulation. From my understanding of things, the potential resides in every latent human to develope into either a Nova or a Psi (To my understanding, they are refered to as either "Psiads" or "Psychomorphs"). The events of their eruption and the type of universal forces they are subjected to will determine how they develope. Because of massive influx of quantum energy in the world, Novas are the most common form of developement. Actually my research has shown me that these two catagories of human developement may not be the only two evolutionary paths. I have heard rumors of a third form of developement, but as of yet I have not uncovered anymore information on them.

Be careful Amnexus, you may be opening a Pandora's box with this. If these theories of mine are true (and from the shared experiences of Mr. Meehan and Jager, I have no reason to doubt those theories), than you may be opening the door to any number of possible mutational/evolutionary pathways. I hope you have a killswitch for your project in case things start to fall apart.

[Jager]

Now we get into the problem of "who is worthy?".

Who do you define as worhty?

I am sure some very wealthy and/or connected individuals feel that they are 'worthy'. I am also sure that when they learn of this, they will contact you about your technology. Of course, so will Utopia, and a few other nova organizations. Good luck. If you need some assistance, let me know. Up until a few weeks ago, I was a freelance troubleshooter.

[Apep]

I think some things are better left alone.

[Hugin]

Wonderful, another mad scientist clone with no concept of social sciences. Just because you can do something doesn't mean that you should.

How about taking just a few seconds and take a look at how the presence of a relatively small number of Novas has disrupted baseline society. We haven't had the chance to create our own society yet and you want to throw the ratio even further out of balance?

I started out trying to be somewhat polite to Cornelius but his actions weren't as poorly thought out as yours. Take heed, there are many Novas, many dangerous Novas who would look poorly on you attempts to simply hand out what they see as a special blessing. I don't think you want them looking you up.

[Wizard]

Amnexus the bodies you are transplanting this tissue into is not capable of handling the energy stressess engendered. You are essentially inflicting tumorous growths.

Re-check your data and ensure you've tested for the intron sequence responsible for the expression of farahcyte growth. Observe that those who experienced classic eruption patterns already possessed the intron sequence while those that exhibit abnormal quantum growth do not and are subject to high levels of uncontrolled taint accumulation.

If you were playing with retrovirus' why, oh why, did you feel the need to graft MR tissue to sentient being and observe the fireworks?

[Guest]

Amenxus,

I currnetly work in a Medical R&D facility and we did a similar experiment, the problem we ran into was that the artifical novas were very weak and extremely prone to Aberrant Syndrome. Within a matter of weeks the subjects would be twisted beyond recognition, after which they became menaces to our baseline staff and nuisances to our novas. The worst side affect was that the majority of them became so warped by the disease that it actually killed them, something that is not seen in natural novas. Needless to say the experiment was abandoned. What we found was that the M-R node is not the only factor that creates a nova. As I'm sure that we have all noticed some novas seem more prone to Aberrant Syndrome than others which we believe is a strictly related to the genetic sequencing in each nova. It is comprable to how two different baselines react to the same disease such as chicken pox, one may barely notice the infection, while another may end up in intensive care. Different novas may have moreor less of a physical tolerance that helps them withstand the effects of manipulating Quantum. Unfortunately, we were never given the funding to try to locate the actual sequence in the nova genome that varies from the human sequence. I would be very interested in discussing your ideas for how to get around those problems, and if you wish I am more than willing to help you with advice or ideas.

[Jager]

Amnexus, my advice is to destroy all hardcopies of your work and keep it in your head. I hope you understand that as dangerous as it is for someone like you (who has some idea of what you are doing) to do this, less scrupulous people would gladly use this as a weapon.

Keep it in your head. Call it a hunch, but I think your running out of time.

Shakti, your funding was cut? Wow, another taint research project goes under. I wonder what could have caused that to happen?

I would recommend you seek assistance from Utopia, except for the fact that 1) they aren't trustworthy when it comes to nova-related medical research and 2) they keep telling the world that 'Aberrant Syndrome' isn't a problem.

[Guest]

Offically there were no funds to dedicate to the project and all R&D projects had to cut way back. In actuality our director had a personal problem with the project supervisor and he bought Utopia's line hook and sinker and believed that Aberrant Syndrome is not something to worry about. We lost two very brillant nova doctors over that.

Thank you for the advice, but I have no interest in working for Project Utopia. They do not test the medicines they proscribe to nova patients half as well as they should.

[Jager]

Shakti, I think you are mistaken. I think Utopia tests its medication very throughly and get the precise results they are looking for. Now, what those results are and what they tell the public might be two different things. But, why would they try something like that?

I also think you missed the sarcasm of my last post. While Utopia has done and continues to do good work around the planet, they are also involved in doing some things which are less than beneficial to various free-thinking individuals.

Mind you, DeVries whores you for money, but at least they are more honest about that. Some other aspects of that agency, aren't as pleasant.

[Stheno]

Since you raised the issue Jager, I always found it rather suspicious that Project Utopia managed to develop no fewer than two drugs (Adrenocilin and Moxinaquantamine) which can interact with the M-R node, less than two years after the first recorded eruptions.

Given that most drugs take more than five years to develop, one has to ask how this occurred at all.

There are several possible answers, and I don't believe anyone here will find them in any way reassuring.

[This message has been edited by Stheno (edited 07-25-2001).]

[Guest]

Jager, I was not speaking of their well known drugs, those have been well and precisly tested, as you say. There are however some less known medicines they have that I feel have not been properly tested. The sheer amount of variances in nova physiology means that medicines designed for them have to undergo more testing than baseline drugs. There is still too much too left to learn about paraphysiology to risk undertesting a drug.

You are correct, I did miss the sarcasm in your post, and I apologize. And as for Devries I'm quite aware of many novas opinions about the company. However, I am doing what I love and am quite happy were I am in this life.

[Jager]

Shakti, sorry you left Ibizia. As for your career, I've got no problem with that. It's good to see someone who has found a place for themselves. Enjoy.

[Guest]

Thank you Jager, I appreciate it. I can't say I like Marakesh, but I should be on my way to more friendly waters by mid next week so I can't complain.

Amnexus, how is your research going? I was hoping to hear whether it was gonig well or not. Have you made progress towards getting past the Aberrant Syndrome problem?

[Hugin]

Why does everyone insist on calling it a problem. Sometimes taint can bring with it remarkable blessings. I appreciate those changes to my physical and psychological makeup that I have received almost as much as those quantum manipulating abilities that I have developed.

I know it's an awful cliche, but we must simply look for the appropriate silver lining.

[Guest]

In regards to how it affects a human body it is a problem. Ebola would be a blessing for any human unfortunate enough to become "infected" by taint as you call it. Novas have a natural way to balance and fight it whereas baselines have none. I too feel blessed by how my body has transformed, but not every nova does.

[Jager]

I have seen far more of our people destroyed by taint than blessed by it. If you can make use of it, so be it. Don't make it out to be anything more than the affliction it is. It is the price too many of us pay for power and the understanding of how to use it. It consumes too many of us and not enough is being done to understand it, and if possible, counteract it.

[Apep]

I do hate to see those who do not understand it or are unable to guide their mutations. Most of the problem stems from themselves holding too tightly to what they once were and not embracing what they are becoming. There is nothing to be afraid of. It is not an affliction.

[Jager]

There is a limit to what even our bodies and minds can take, Apep. I have seen people die, fighting it like it was some disease, every step of the way. I have also seen those who have embraced it as part and parcel of their evolution. It still finally overwhelmed their sense of self and they expired.

I know that they are certain methods to contain it or hold its advance at bay, but they bear their own price tags. Worse, they don't resolve the underlying problem of why we get taint in the first place. I would like some answers, not bandaids or fables.

[Guest]

I do think Jager has a point worth noting. Many of my own associates would proudly say that taint is the way to true power and enlightenment. HOwever, many of them have become overwhelmed by it themselves and given in to serious mental problems far more worrisome than any physical mutations. Research on taint is needed, a fuller understanding of what it is, what it does, etc. Thankfully I know of at least one nove genius doing excellent work along those lines. Until we understand taint more fully, I would point us all in the direction of Shakespeare, "All things in moderation." Take care friends.

Hydra

[Hugin]

Shakti-Humans don't get taint, at least not in the normal course of events. Zia has done some remarkable experiments that have resulted in some unusual taint applications and baselines. Now Novas, yes they can get taint, and some of us are more subject to it than others, but there are tools at our disposal to deal with it.

Jaeger-Have you not come across some of these techniques? I myself have developed a sense of mental control that allows me a great deal of control over my mental aberrations. Any truly erupted Nova has the potential for developing the same skills. Now, for the purely physical, a friend of mine, Morganna Barrows (the last surviving member of the Barrows Triplets)developed the ability to manipulate taint in such a way as to permenently shape aberrations. Now, she had remarkable quantum skill and I would hesistate to say that *anyone* could achieve this but it is possible.

[Guest]

James, Taint is a problem. Not because it is bad or evil, like Utopia would have you believe, but because so many people have no consious control of it. There are very few novas in the world that have a good grasp of what taint truly represents, and those that do are card carrying members of the Teregen for the most part. I would hazzard a guess that even most Terats don't even truly understand all the ramifications of the force that they are playing with.

"Taint" has been theorized to be one of the forces behind nova evolution. This may very well be true. If that is the case then why are so many people so eager to screw around with it? James, you and others here have citicized and ridiculed the scientifically minded, like Amnexus and Cornelius, who you feel are not examining the social ramifications of thier work. How does that differ from the experimentation the Teregen does with Taint? Evolution is a largly unknown process that the Teregen willingly (and some might say blindly) experiment with. Each Terat that undergoes Chrysalis attempts to take evolution into their own hands without regard to the repercussions and ramifications to the species as a whole. Evolution is not a process personal growth, but one that is meant to affect species as a whole. Novas' next evolutionary step should begin with our children, not in seeing how quickly we can change through "taint" manipulation.

I see "taint" as the nova body's way of adapting to the excess of quantum forces coursing through a vessel not designed to handle them. Our offspring should be more capable of handling this strain, and thus be less afllicted by "taint." This process of adaptaion should continue through the generations until, finally, novas will be a truly individual and unique species, and "taint" will be a mere legend. We are a long way away from that day however.

[Hugin]

You actually illustrate quite well why I have little problem with Terats playing around with Chrysalis as opposed to Amnexus and Cornelius' tinkering around with forces they only pretend to understand.

If Nova A decides to engage in the development of Chrysalis (a procedure I don't yet pretend to understand) he or she is experimenting on *their own being*. Cornelius and Amnexus are making, or attempting to make, wholesale changes to entire species. Cornelius victimized chimpanzees and in fact attempted to do this to the entire species. He then improved their knowledge of warfare and armed them. All the while refusing to see any flaws in his plans. Amnexus, I don't know enough about to make any accurate judgments, but again is trying to work on a scale that I doubt he truly understands.

That is the difference I see. I do note however that you did not acknowledge that there are skill that can be developed to control taint, does it worry you that others who are more foward thinking than yourself might be willing to use taint as a tool rather than see it as the curse that you do? Oh, I wish Ashnod would return to this forum, she does a splendid job of expressing Terat viewpoints.

[Guest]

I am forward thinking James. That is why the Teregen's current obsession with Chrysalis and Taint manipulation concern me, and why I don't become more involved with the movement than I already am. I am trying to look beyond the concept of "personal evolution" and instead look at what is best for the race as a whole (in my opinion).

I know there are some novas who can manipulate taint energy with skill and precision, however, I am forced to wonder how well they understand the forces they manipulate? Remember these are universal energies and forces we play with, can any of us say we have truly "mastered" any of them? Can anyone say they are in complete control of their Taint? Can anyone say they even come close, and not be deluding themselves? Maybe Mal, but he's probably the only one, and he is the one who introduced Chrysalis to the Teregen in the first place.I wonder at the true purpose of the Chrysalis and the real agenda of the man who brought it to the Teregen.

As for your argument against Cornelius and Amnexus, the same could be said about Divis. Sure, it is each Terat's own choice to experience the Chrysalis (I'm sure that is what Amnexus would say of his test subjects too) but think about this. How much peer pressure has been exerted on individual members of the movement (like the Count for example) to undergo the process? What happened to Caroline Fong and others like her? I have no problems with people experimenting with Taint and trying to use it as a tool for personal growth. It is just not the only way and I'm tired of die hard "taint-monkeys" (both Terat and non-Terat) saying that it is.

Oh, by the way. I never said it was a curse. Dangerous yes, but not a curse. You have confused me with other individuals on these forums.

[Jager]

Some Teragen members recruit novas with the claim that the Teragen have mastered taint. James, while you certainly don't do it, other terats do. It is a lie. Yes, they have methods for channeling their taint to a degree, but few can claim to being even close to understanding the process and how it works. As for taint manipulation, since when did a nova have to understand a force to be able to use it? Novas don't have to understand what they do, the quantum does it for us. That certain folks have learned to harness other people's taint as a weapon against them isn't what I would call an edorsement. Yes, you have developed techniques for dealing with your mental aberrations. I am well aware of them, but this is no better than figuring out ways to keep a cancer in remission or elevate blood cell counts. It isn't a cure, nor is it even an understanding of the cause. It is just countering the symptoms of elevated taint. What I want to know is why you developed these aberrations in the first place? Why don't I have any, at all? I admit that I have an abject fear of becoming personally afflicted with taint. I don't hold other people to my fears and have had and do have friends with massive levels of taint.

I can relate this from my personal experiences. Those who seek to use or control their taint do so on borrowed time. As the pressure for them to advance and expand their knowledges and powers contiues to increase unabbated, their ability to stay ahead or in control will diminish.

[Guest]

Prodigy, of course humans don't suffer from taint in any natural way, I was refering to the type of experiments that Amnexus is performing and that I have seen attempted elsewhere. These procedures artifically grant a baseline a novas abilities, whether it is through a retrovirus or implanting MR tissue with in the brain, the baseline(s) involved are left without any way to deal with the side effects of taint. In this case the baselines involved are warped more horribly and quickly than any nova. That is all I was talking about.

[Apep]

I'm sorry James, I don't know if you'll be hearing from Ashnod again. I wish I could speak for her or even like her but I didn't inherit her way with words.

[Jager]

Apep, what is that all about? Where's Ashnod?

[Guest]

Apep here, None of my posts are getting through!!!!

anyways, Rest assured, Ashnod the Uncaring will return. Nothing for you to worry your pretty little head about.

[Ashnod]

It's wonderful to know that I am so loved and missed by my colleagues.

Adept,

I disagree vehemently with your statement about evolution pertaining only to the species and not the individual. Even without Chrysalis, my evolution has taken a vastly different path than that of my daughter's. Our quantum abilities don't overlap in any tangible sense. Mostly, one might argue, certainly Farah Rashoud and a few others, it is because our abilities are directed by our own will and subconscious desire. Apep sought (and seeks) to develop herself along a very specific pattern, which, when compared to mine, makes the two of us out to be almost entirely different species. This is no different from any two of us compared side by side, I merely use my family since you indicated that it is our second generation that will determine how our people are evolving.

Chrysalis, of course, has accelerated this split among our evolution, but merely accelerated it. The split would have taken place regardless of Chrysalis or Taint. Such is the nature of our species, folks: we are first and foremost individuals. Why do you think community amongst us is so difficult? Save for our Mazarin-Rashoud Node, we don't have any common bonds that would allow us to evolve as a nation or a species. Our only true bond is the Node, and just as importantly, how it separates us from those who do not possess it.

Evolution for our species is a highly personal matter. Highly. I cannot stress that enough. I cannot walk my daughter's path, nor she mine. Our paths criss-cross, and occasionally run parallel, but never truly overlap the other.

I will state that you're correct on the matter of the danger of playing around with Taint without fully understanding what you will be getting into. Apep's statement about holding tightly to what you were instead of embracing what you are becoming is a very poignant one. Forcing change without giving thought to how you will be forever altered demonstrates a severe lack of enlightement. Which, as you are good to point out, happens more than we'd like within the Terat movement. There is, however, nothing at all wrong about seeking out evolution if you are ready for it. I'm not going to get too indepth into the whole "who is ready and who is not" argument, though someone will doubtlessly challenge me on it, because the answer to that is just as infuriating as most facets of enlightment. Simply, if you think you're ready, you aren't. If you know you're ready, you are. It's a fine line, I realize this, but truths are often found within such lines. Many of our people have experimented with Chrysalis when they weren't ready. That's unfortunate, but there's very little we can do to prevent it from happening.

I also find your statement about novas being a truly unique and evolved species only after enough generations have passed that Taint is merely a myth somewhat insulting. Perhaps it is a nice idea that one day our people will not know Taint, but I think it's overlooking the wonder of what we already are. Belittling it, in fact. Conceivably, this first generation will one day become immune to Taint as we learn more about it. It's no more a radical idea than your proposal of the immunity of our progeny.

And, lastly, I'm curious. You say that you have no problem with Novas using Taint (I also assume you mean Chrysalis) as a focus for personal evolution (you used the word growth, but the intent behind it I believe is identical. Interesting that you have no problem with personal evolution, but also state that you don't believe evolution should be personal), and then also say that Taint is an affliction. Is this a contradiction, or do you truely believe it is or can be both?

[This message has been edited by Ashnod (edited 08-09-2001).]

[Jager]

Ashnod, if our evolution will be purely along individual tracks, are we a series of individual mutations and not a species? If that is the case, doesn't that make conflict among novas that much more likely? Or, are novas redefining precepts of evolution from the strictly physical to something more abstract?

It is good to hear from you again.

[Guest]

I know that the question you posted previously was not directed at me Jager, but I hope you will not mind if I give my opinion. First, I would like to point that essentially all of our abilities and developments, no matter how individual or unique, are allt eh same on a fundamental level. All we novas do is manipulate quantum. Period. Each of us doees it in a different way, but if you examine the interactions, energy expenditure, etc. it all boils down to the same manipulation being directed in varying ways. I know of a few novas who can "see" quantum manipulation occuring and notice its patterns. It's all a matter of the "directions" quantum is channeled in. That is my first arguement for why we are a species as opposed to individual mutants. Second would be the basic fact of evolutionary science as it stands that 90% of mutations are harmful and most fatal. This seems to cast doubt on us being a collection of random mutations. LAstly, I must bring out the tired old horses of the M-R node and Taint. All novas have these, no matter how individual their abilities or powers.

On to your question regarding our evolution. I would argue that the instant any of us erupts,t hey take an evolutionary step that can only be considered abstract. This follows an eruption arguement that i support, that eruption triggers conscious or unconscious wants and manifests them. What can be more abstract than that? Particulariy in how they manifest. Allow me to use myself as an example. I was a person who always wanted to be better than he was, stronger, smarter, faster. I did well with education and fitness but it was not enough, I was not good enough. Due to an unforeseen accident I had serious spinal and back damamge. I was in surgery to try and save a degree of mobility when I erupted. In retrospect I realize all those wants were realized. I became stronger, faster, smarter, and especially tougher than any human and many novas. More than anything though I had felt alone since the accident, and hated it. When I erupted, I was assured of never being alone again. For those who do not know me, twin "dragon" heads and necks grew from my shoulderblades. They are part of me, but are also seperate. Gyoro and Ururun make sure I am never alone. Could a development be more absact than that? Our evolution, through Taint or otherwise, is not becoming abstract over physical. It has always been that way. Any opinions from the rest of you on this subject? I hope I haven't bored any of you. Regardless, I wish you all the best. Take care friends.

P.S. Jager, the New England thing I looked into has been taken care of. The one responsible is currently being taken care of. rest assured, he will be helped and is not a danger now. Hopefully he will respond well to treatment and cease being a danger altogether. I thought you would like to know.

[Jager]

Hydra, thanks for answering. I am glad that your project is back on track.

As for the evolution question, I believe we are evolving as individuals, but I am still not sure if our evolutionary similarities make us a species as much as our differing paths take us apart. Still looking for more information on this matter.

[Ashnod]

Quote:

Originally posted by Jager:
Ashnod, if our evolution will be purely along individual tracks, are we a series of individual mutations and not a species? If that is the case, doesn't that make conflict among novas that much more likely? Or, are novas redefining precepts of evolution from the strictly physical to something more abstract?
It is good to hear from you again.

Jager, Jager, Jager...

Silly boy...a species that originates in a distinct form, but has the ability to evolve independently is a species nonetheless. Random mutations would imply no parallels or comparable biological reasons for these changes to occur. In our case, we have definable parameters for the "base" state from which we erupt (I speak only of the process of eruption itself), which at the moment of eruption everyone is more or less theoretically the same in terms of biology and potential to evolve. What happens immediately after is, of course, highly individualistic.

However, Jager, I would also like to point out that I didn't say that our evolution was solely that of an individual. There is no reason why future generations may inherit, as has been proposed, a higher resistance to Taint or way of processing it more effectively. I merely meant to stress that will we evolve different from each other on an individual level, and more importantly, that there is nothing wrong with that or that we should look unfavorably upon those who choose to do so.

[Jager]

Actually, Ashnod, I was trying to hint at the theory that were are evolving along non-biological lines. No matter how we evolve biologically, we all manifest that by increasing our ability to manipulate and process quantum energy. We may do it in different ways, but our overall increase ability in quantum control is identical. That is the similarity that I was hoping others would reach for. Oh, well.

Glad to have you back.

[Guest]

That sounds terrible. Why would anyone want to do that!!! Arent there enough of us already.

[Jager]

Some folks don't think so.