World of Darkness: Attrition - Official OOC Thread

[Ira Sagebrush]

an injected needle full of *insert drug here* is perfectly rational. But please, accuse me of metagaming. Anytime someone is date raped, they should just take the orgasm for what it is and walk away. Especially when some creepy guy walks outta the bushes after and escorts you away saying it was perfectly fine.

[Toby Lupin]

Ok, dude. That is about as insulting as you can get eh? I am seriously wondering about leaving WoDA again.

[Dawn OOC]

[Forge] 9:33 am: romeo fully believed he was drugged and will be calling 911 shortly to report assault

- then he's going to have only his explanation with no wounds, when a girl apparently grabbed and kissed him from behind. And the 'orgasmic feeling'? That just adds on to the credibility... the police are going to love having their time wasted.

Jer... I have no words for this. Oh, wait, I do: don't go there. There are drugs that cause orgasmic feelings; that's like saying the police wouldn't be interested in pursuing a rape because the victim 'enjoyed' it. A man went to a party, was grabbed by a woman acting shady, she touched his neck and now he feels drugged. That is battery. Then her friends show up and are herding him away from her, trying to tell him nothing happened.

Forge is not metagaming. His mortal PC is have a mortal reaction to being attacked. He's on various meds; what if they react with whatever he was just drugged with? He could die from drug interactions. The smartest thing to do is call the police and get himself to a hospital for testing, just in case he does have a reaction.

On a side note: Lucien and Oneca are going to be pissed. This should be awesome.

[Ira Sagebrush]

How so?

You think it is metagaming for Romeo to assume he was assaulted? The Kiss is the Vampire equivalent of date rape, it is against the victim's will and they don't remember it except for some vague fuzzy thing.

[Dawn OOC]

Ok, dude. That is about as insulting as you can get eh? I am seriously wondering about leaving WoDA again.

Jer, come on. You accused him of metagaming and he didn't insult you. He refuted your statement sarcastically.

I really hope that you don't threaten leaving each and every time something doesn't go your way in WoDA. That sort of thing gets old. I'll have a lot more respect for you if you take a deep breath and calm down (walking away from the computer if necessary), then talk about it with us instead of throwing around accusations and threats to vamoose.

[Owns-The-Night]

Ok, dude. That is about as insulting as you can get eh? I am seriously wondering about leaving WoDA again.

Lighten up. Romeo wasn't being any more than bitingly (hee) ironic.

And seriously enough, anyone who throws around 'I'm leaving and taking my ball with me' only manages to engender feelings that they can mind that the door doesn't hit their arse on the way out. This is all Pretendy-Fun-Time-Games, Forge is not metagaming, and you are overreacting.

As Dawn said, this shit gets old.

[Jeremy]

Anytime someone is date raped, they should just take the orgasm for what it is and walk away.

Guys, this sounds pretty much like a deliberate insult, and unless I am wrong, I'm getting that and now you guys are telling me to Lighten Up? Something like that crosses the "Pretend Fun Games" line. This is my problem. I said in chat, that I would walk away from this, fine... but Romeo appears to have upped this now. THAT's the issue.

[Jeremy]

Jer... I have no words for this. Oh, wait, I do: don't go there. There are drugs that cause orgasmic feelings; that's like saying the police wouldn't be interested in pursuing a rape because the victim 'enjoyed' it.

For the record, this was new to me, the part about the drugs, I didn't know. So now having heard this, I can find Forge's arguments more reasonable.

[Dawn OOC]

For the record, this was new to me, the part about the drugs, I didn't know. So now having heard this, I can find Forge's arguments more reasonable.

Yeah, that's a part of what E does, as I recall. Triggers pleasure centers. And I vaguely recall a drug being using for a medical condition caused actual orgasms in a few of the women it was tested on.

And even if I'm wrong, drugs are almost magic in the public mindset, to the layperson. A drug that makes people have orgasmic feelings wouldn't be that hard for the public to accept. No doctor would believe it

[Owns-The-Night]

And I vaguely recall a drug being using for a medical condition caused actual orgasms in a few of the women it was tested on.

It's called "Declanzapam"

[SalmonMax]

Deep breaths everyone. Lets do our "I feel" communication.

Jeremy, rather than accuse Forge of insulting you...which just escalates things...lets rephrase that message to read, "I feel personally insulted by Forge's post."

It gets your point across without the finger-wagging.

Similarly, Forge, lets say something like, "I feel that Jeremy's accusation that I was metagaming was unfair." And then there's plenty of evidence that it was.

That gets us past the defensive stuff and lets us move to resolution. Hopefully.

[Dave ST]

Alrighty, I have a simple question for all of you:

What flavor of WoD:A would you like?

In retrospect I think one of the major things that holds my interest in a World of Darkness game is the action. You may feel differently, but this is my post so nya. As a player I'm all about the drama and the romance (believe it or not I love equal amounts of drama and romance in my games) of a chronicle. The ups and downs, the life or death situations, tales of love lost or found. It's a dark and evil world and my PCs are just one soul trying to stay sane in a world that gets darker with every day. Here in WoD:A I think that we, the players, do a fine job of working up our own drama and romance but we seem to slow down after a bit because, well, there's nothing going on accept drama and romance...

So here is where my question comes in. We can be as dark and broody as we like, it would make sense, but I want to remind everyone that it's not reality, we are playing super people in a very dark and oppressive world that govered not by people, but by mystical forces and all things that fall in the 'Completely Fucked Up' category. What do we have to work with? Lets take a look...

Were-Critters (incuding everything 'were')

Vampires

Mages (thaumaturges and witches too!)

Demons (if you can think it, we can create it with the rules)

Hunters

Spirits (like demons, you name it, we can make it up)

Mortal Crazies

Cults

Evil Artefacts

Bizarre Rituals

Ghosts

Holy crap, that's a lot of antagonists...

So with all that in mind, how campy do we want this to be? Do want it to be like a weekly run drama where the PCs are always running into one twisted spirit or another causing problems in their lives or some whacky cult or coven of college witches summoning up trouble (on accident or on purpose). A world where some Super-Big-Bad seems to be the flavor of the week in his grand scheme for ruling the California Free State?

Basically, how much do we want the world saturated is whackiness and the super natural?

My personal opinion is that since it's the World of Darkness that ach of the PCs is a 'warrior' of some sort against the normalcy. They are chosen in one aspect or another to be different and to face the hordes of evil and strangeness as they come. This can take a lot of forms from drama, to romance, to action... but I'm not playing 'Average Joe'. Writing fictions about collecting a paycheck and battling the forces of monotony are not my idea of fun. My characters are super natural so it stands to reason that the supernatural is their 'normal' and the things they stand against are far normal than anyone who is not a super would every dream of believing.

So, again... what flavor would you like?

[Jeremy]

My personal opinion is that since it's the World of Darkness that ach of the PCs is a 'warrior' of some sort against the normalcy. They are chosen in one aspect or another to be different and to face the hordes of evil and strangeness as they come. This can take a lot of forms from drama, to romance, to action... but I'm not playing 'Average Joe'. Writing fictions about collecting a paycheck and battling the forces of monotony are not my idea of fun. My characters are super natural so it stands to reason that the supernatural is their 'normal' and the things they stand against are far normal than anyone who is not a super would every dream of believing.

So, again... what flavor would you like?

I like the way you think. Of course, the idea of fending off Big Bads at some point or other as a group appeals.

[jameson (ST)]

Horror.

[Owns-The-Night]

I'm completely in favor of the PC's standing between the darkness and the light, some on the darker side of the line and others on the lighter. The worst-natured of the PCs *cough-OTN-cough* should be a puddytat compared to the real badness out there, though. Foes could range from the inconvenient: scheming vamps, bullying uratha, crazy Fae, over-curious Mages etc - that need a combination of investigation, diplomacy, maneuvering and strongarming to solve - to the deadly: 'Pro' hunters, demons, Bale Hounds, rabid Pure on the warpath, Nephandi (or whatever they are in nWoD), sparkling vampires (the worst kind) and the like, which needs the PCs to pull together and get ready to shed blood, preferably that of the bad guys. (Dec's Handy Hint #1: If more of your blood is on the ground than your opponent's, you're probably losing.)

Every now and then complications like day job and so on should pop up, if only to shine a light on what a 'monster' has to go through to blend in. Dec takes shit from his boss and puts up with people snickering behind his back about 'Crazy Perault' because a) it's good camoflage and b ) he's not such a monster that he'll rip someone apart just for being a petty asshole. But I agree with Dave that the mundane shouldn't be the focus of the setting. The mundane should predominantly serve to highlight how abnormal these supernatural people's lives are. When Sam goes to the PTA meetings and hears other moms talking about soccer practice or little league or the school play, it should jar with her how innocent these people are of what's out there lurking. When Oneca hears some college occultist-wannabes talk about going to the National Cemetary to play with a ouijia board, she should think 'ye gods, these dumb kids have no idea how dangerous that is', even though the 'kids' aren't much younger than her, if at all.

[SalmonMax]

With a cast as big as WODA, there's room for all of the above. I agree, we need threads that involve us doing things other than each other. Rather desperately, in fact. I suggest we either collaborate as player/writers about such a thread and the very, very general shape it'll take beforehand...or perhaps a mod will occasionally want to start one.

By collaborate, I mean that the basic outline of the idea would be presented in a post. Player says, "I have an idea for a Plot Thread where aliens start mutilating cows around town and we have to stop them!" And then other players who think that's a good fit for their character can pitch in and say, "Maybe they start abducting humans...or even other supernaturals!" And finally the basic shape of the idea is hammered down..."The aliens' science can't explain supernaturals, and our existence is the only thing holding them back from a full invasion! We have to stop them before they work out what our weaknesses are!" At any time a mod can weigh in and say, "That's retarded. Rethink it," or "Awesome, that's giving me some fun ideas to spring." Etc.

Then the posting can begin. Clearly the posts wouldn't just blab out the plot all at once...we'd make it a story. And of course, just because we think we know the shape of it doesn't mean a mod can't pop in and throw a wrench in. But I think if we feel like we know what we're building to, it'll give us more confidence and help avoid the "what now?" endless waiting loop that sometimes afflicts PBP's.

[Jeremy]

I like that process... in fact... idea to propose...

Edit- Idea moved to appropriate thread.

[Dawn OOC]

I agree with what Max said. However...

I'd like to see a separate thread for plot ideas. If we put them here, they'll get lost. Another thread for just those ideas will allow us to go, "Man, we need something to happen. Oh! See what plot ideas are out there."

The only thing I'd add to Max's post is this: we should voluntarily limit the number of people on a story. Not because I don't want to play with you all, but because the more people you get, the more likely it is to get slowed down and eventually lost by one person having RL issues or slowdown problems. We've had it happen to all of us. And I'm not saying that every story has to go gangbusters. But a post every third or fourth day is the minimum to keep stuff moving. So maybe four people jump on a story together, and everyone else lets them do that while they find something else to glom onto.

And of course, there can be stories where we all have a part in it, and the final chapter is epic and involves everyone. There should be times we all get together for something other than parties.

Just my thoughts.

[SalmonMax]

Sound reasoning, Dawn. Though we'll need to have a good way to work out who gets into any given plot thread, if it's a popular one. First come first served?

I suppose the players contributing can decide. Ideally...IDEALLY...the plot will lend itself to some PC's more than others, and those of us that it doesn't really touch on can keep ourselves out.

Like if a plot is not really tied to mages, environmentalism, or spirits...then Triessa may not be a good choice for a participating PC.

Hopefully there'll be enough plot threads at any given moment that everyone can have a story that fits them, without feeling like they have to try to crowd into a story that might not be suited for them.

[Dawn OOC]

Max, or we break it into parts. Rather like Jim is doing for Sam right now, we have a large plot that everyone touches from a different angle. Like the vampire thing Jer mentioned. The developers buying the park could upset environmentalists, which gets most of the ferals and Tree involved. Then you have Sarah and Nigel dealing with it from the supernatural end, while Lucien notes it's a competitor and he's trying to deal with the business issues it's causing. Then if it goes to a head, we deal with the Epic Ending - or perhaps Lucien's boardroom antics kill it before the ferals can do more than start to sniff around. Perhaps the ferals save Lucien from having to deal with it because they shut construction down violently by getting hints from Sarah (who can't be seen acting against this much more powerful vampire) about the true powers pushing this.

That doesn't leave room for all the PCs to naturally be involved, but that did include a chunk of them in that example.

[SalmonMax]

Good point! The best way perhaps is just to have a candid discussion of ideas for which characters can do what as part of the plot thread....if a player has a good 'in' for his or her PC and it works with the story, then it's probably okay if they do that.

[Dave ST]

Although the idea was unspoken, where certain plots are limited to certain players, it was something I had planned for some of the Mod ran plot threads. Basically, based on previous plots and how you, the players, solved the issues, I was simply going to inform you and state "Plot Thread: This fiction involves Larry, Curly and Moe and happens on the night/day of following the events of <previous thread>.

Gods, I hate to use this as a reference... but... in shows Like Heracles, Xena, Buffy, Angel, etc... they had a very large cast of people (The PCs) but not every episode involves every PC. I hoped on running the plot stuff a lot like a TV show except that we don't have any one single star the show is centered around, it belongs to us all. Sometimes it's Declan's chance for the spotlight, other times it is Sarah's turn. Right now, obviously, with the PCs not really familiar with each other yet it's going to be a bit slow in the teams dept and things will be solo for a bit, but that will change.

Although only one person here can claim to have ever gamed with me running the table, were she here she'd attest that I like to see it when every PC is in the spotlight from time to time. There are other times when some PC are intentionally but on the back burner so other can have their moment of glory or fame. We're all adults, so I don't see that as being an issue, but it still stands to be said. I'd very much like for all PCs to have a field where they specialize, and so far we have a pretty diverse group.

"I don't know anything about forensics or detective work dude... we're not going to find anything amongst all this crap."

"Me either... but I know someone who does..."

*A knock on Sam's door 20 minutes later...*

We all will have a part to play, and I hope by working together we can find many ways to tell many different stories.

[z-August Turner]

Reven, your post above fills me with warm tinglies. I look forward to seeing how this changes mod plots going forward.

And just to the rest of you: I'm not going to stretch my personal plots to make sure everyone in the game gets involved in each and every one of them. I will try to do something, and build deep relationships, with each of you. If I ask you hard questions about why you want to be involved in this, please don't take it personally. I'm just making sure that good story gets made, regardless of who's making it.

[SalmonMax]

This. ^

[z-August Turner]

/me gently points people toward Boot Scooting.

The party may be over, but we still have more ficcing to do!

[Ira Sagebrush]

[z-August Turner]

No worries - real life is brutal sometimes.

[Sarah Dead-Wolf]

I've been scarce and kinda non-posty this week. It's been hectic, but I'm following along. Anyway, lotsa daytime stories happening right now, and I'm kinda limited in that regard.

[z-August Turner]

I've been scarce and kinda non-posty this week. It's been hectic, but I'm following along. Anyway, lotsa daytime stories happening right now, and I'm kinda limited in that regard.

That's fair. Let me know if you have a plotsy idea and need my PC on it - I'd be happy to give you another place to post.

[z-Shane O'Neally]

I took the liberty to recycle an old fiction of mine in "Big Bad Wolf" since it felt ok to do it. I hope you guys don't mind since it was meant to be kind of an introductory post for him anyway (I mean the last reboot).

[Owns-The-Night]

No problem here. And I thought Dec had anger issues...

[z-August Turner]

Those of us in Boot - do we want to RP through the drinking games or play them out?

[Owns-The-Night]

I'm happy either way. We can skippity the shenanigans by working out the narrative highlights, or play through if we feel said shenanigans would be interesting. Either way, the story moves forward.

[Swara-Ann]

If someone is interested I'd like to get together and do some writing with Swara. My schedule is back to normal now and barring Deus Ex or Dead Island my posting should be back to normal. Same goes for Lucien, I need to set up some connections for both my PCs with some of the other PCs.

[Owns-The-Night]

I'd be interested in forging links with both Lucien and Swara. I'm certain the two wolves will get along like a house on fire!

[Dave ST]

Cool. Let me know which one you'd like to start with and we'll work on a story from there. Personally I'm not picky so which ever you think will most the fun for a fiction, we'll go with that.

[Kaitlin Vandussen]

I wouldn't mind doing a fic with Swara, maybe starting off with them meeting during a morning run or something. Hell, that could work with Declan too.

[z-August Turner]

While we're talking posting, I'd like to ask Oneca or Aradia to crash "Stopping By" please.

[SalmonMax]

Lucien and Triessa need to bonk heads...and in fact, it might good if all the 'magi' at the party had their own fic thread afterwards, since Triessa will do her best to get them all in a room together. That'd be Lucien, Aradia, and Astra, I believe.

Depending on how that goes, Lucien might wind up with three tutors and a cabal...or just a few friends in the know.

[z-Wakiki Izumi]

Lucien and Triessa need to bonk heads...and in fact, it might good if all the 'magi' at the party had their own fic thread afterwards, since Triessa will do her best to get them all in a room together. That'd be Lucien, Aradia, and Astra, I believe.

Depending on how that goes, Lucien might wind up with three tutors and a cabal...or just a few friends in the know.

I'd like to be in on this - if possible, can we hold off until Wakiki is approved? He's almost there, so I hope it won't take much longer. In fact, I'm hoping to get him into Boogie soon, if he's approved soon enough, so people would have reason to know him.