Trinity RPG - Psion Powers Above Level 5

[Heru]

In most of the games established by White Wolf their are epic levels of power and might. These levels are usually levels 6-10. I was wondering if the Trinity Psions have these 6+ levels.

And if not officially, are there any unofficial fanmade versions.

And if no, can you explain why Psions are different than the vast majority of normal White Wolf games.

[BlueNinja]

In most of the games established by White Wolf their are epic levels of power and might. These levels are usually levels 6-10. I was wondering if the Trinity Psions have these 6+ levels.

And if not officially, are there any unofficial fanmade versions.

And if no, can you explain why Psions are different than the vast majority of normal White Wolf games.

Five dots, in any mode, is pretty freaking powerful. Unsoakable damage, total mind control, among other things. Five dots in the mode boosts the lower level powers.

Boosting Psi up to 9-10 dots (since you can start with a max of 8) isn't hard, but other than range/successes, it doesn't do as much for you.

But modes do not go above 5 dots because that would allow PCs to outstrip the Proxies, who are already the most power psions Earth has. Since the psionic power levels are artificially limited by the Doyen's methods, it's good to leave it that way.

[Heru]

Five dots, in any mode, is pretty freaking powerful. Unsoakable damage, total mind control, among other things. Five dots in the mode boosts the lower level powers.

Boosting Psi up to 9-10 dots (since you can start with a max of 8) isn't hard, but other than range/successes, it doesn't do as much for you.

But modes do not go above 5 dots because that would allow PCs to outstrip the Proxies, who are already the most power psions Earth has. Since the psionic power levels are artificially limited by the Doyen's methods, it's good to leave it that way.

Okay, thats cool. And it makes a lot of sense actually.

Another question, (I really need to get my hands on the ST Trinity book) can you have more Modes in your Aptitude than just three. I cannot tell from the sources that I do have access to.

Also, was their ever thoughts on removing the artificial limitations of one Aptitude in the game to allow for more varied (but still levels 1 to 5) powers.

[BlueNinja]

Another question, (I really need to get my hands on the ST Trinity book) can you have more Modes in your Aptitude than just three. I cannot tell from the sources that I do have access to.

There are "alternate" modes in one of the books (maybe a fan book, I don't recall) but I think you are still limited to three modes in your Aptitude, and three single-dot Auxiliary modes.

Also, was their ever thoughts on removing the artificial limitations of one Aptitude in the game to allow for more varied (but still levels 1 to 5) powers.

You can be a Psiad. Psiads have their starting Psi limited to 5, and can have any mode from any aptitude (except Quantakinesis), but cannot raise their modes above 3 dots without a Psi of 9 or 10, and can never have a mode at 5 dots. The rules for psiads are in the APG.

[Alex Green]

There was talk about the bio-morphs figuring out about the limits built into the devices and taking them out, but NOTHING cannon-wise beyond developer rumor.

And this wouldn't help the current set of dunk-tank people, just future ones. I think you'd end up with something like 3 primary power sets and then secondary sets that were more expensive.

[Heru]

There are "alternate" modes in one of the books (maybe a fan book, I don't recall) but I think you are still limited to three modes in your Aptitude, and three single-dot Auxiliary modes.

You can be a Psiad. Psiads have their starting Psi limited to 5, and can have any mode from any aptitude (except Quantakinesis), but cannot raise their modes above 3 dots without a Psi of 9 or 10, and can never have a mode at 5 dots. The rules for psiads are in the APG.

Interesting, very interesting.

Thanks for giving me some information on the rules. The way they set up the Psi Powers system is an intriguing mix of standard White Wolf and uniqueness and I wanted to know more about it. I must say though, that I do not like the limitations and the lack of new powers and whatnot. Now I can understand that this might be because the setting was was canceled before it could have been updated to second edition. Still, it is disquieting that they make it so gaining new powers and facets are so hard.

Yeah, I've read about the Psiad in Aberrant Players Guide. I must say I really like it, both in its Aberrant rules form and in its Trinity rules form. Its an interesting mix of flexibility and stricture.

I also want to say that while I understand their reasons for restricting access to the Quantikinesis Aptitude, I think it would have been nifty for psiads to exist in plane sight by hiding their noetic powers through their use of quantikinesis. It would have been an interesting concept.

Of course, I would probably remove the restriction, but that is just me.

There was talk about the bio-morphs figuring out about the limits built into the devices and taking them out, but NOTHING cannon-wise beyond developer rumor.

And this wouldn't help the current set of dunk-tank people, just future ones. I think you'd end up with something like 3 primary power sets and then secondary sets that were more expensive.

Its interesting that tis the bio-morphs that would find it. It shows they might have added it as genetic or at least a body effect. This is an intriguing glimpse in how the Doyen operate.

Yeah your right, as the restriction would still be on. Of course, and I can't remember where I read this, but something said that the Venezuela Incident weakened the restrictions on Psion power usage. I don't know, ti sounds both cool and overpowering as that once incident seems to be as much as a deux ex machina as Divis Mal and Max Mercer are.

[Alex Green]

Its interesting that tis the bio-morphs that would find it. It shows they might have added it as genetic or at least a body effect.

It was the bio-morphs that found it because they were the only crew with a spare tank to test. They stole the quantum-manip's tank during the raid. With that they looked to see was the differences between the two and could make alterations without being afraid of breaking it and messing up their own group forever.

Also keep in mind that the quantum experimenters tank was probably extremely different from the others simply because it wasn't built to be used by an order. There weren't 8 orders, there were 7 and one experiment.

So basically the bio-manips have been continuing the old research, and eventually the research created the Venezuela Incident, but somewhere along the way they figured out that all the tanks had these limits built into them and could be removed without killing the subject.

[Heru]

It was the bio-morphs that found it because they were the only crew with a spare tank to test. They stole the quantum-manip's tank during the raid. With that they looked to see was the differences between the two and could make alterations without being afraid of breaking it and messing up their own group forever.

Also keep in mind that the quantum experimenters tank was probably extremely different from the others simply because it wasn't built to be used by an order. There weren't 8 orders, there were 7 and one experiment.

So basically the bio-manips have been continuing the old research, and eventually the research created the Venezuela Incident, but somewhere along the way they figured out that all the tanks had these limits built into them and could be removed without killing the subject.

Oh, wow, I didn't know this. So glad that you posted it. Interesting concept such as this makes me realize that though I badmouth Trinity for its useless blocking of Aberrant's potential, I do love it for itself. That I feel it is a great setting with a lot of potential.

[Finbar]

My campaign featured a house rule that allowed a "fourth mode": Meta-Psi. It allowed you to manipulate your other psi abilities.

Also: Stupid Question Time: Where is the limit on auxillary modes noted? I know there is the one-dot limit, and you can't combine them with freeform, but I didn't know there was a limit to how many you could have...

FR

[Blue Thunder]

Actually, it's not the biokinetics that were to unlock multiple aptitudes in a single psion, it was the new psi organization that was going to form in Africa (in Bright Continent). The group stole material from several tanks, and figured out how to remove some of the Doyen blocks.

This was going to lead into Trinity Second Edition, after the Coalition attack on Earth, in which characters would not be limited to a single Aptitude.

As it stands now, since we're doing Bright Continent here as a fan e-book, the new psi organization cannot fully unlock a person's psionic potential. They can only unlock a Secondary Aptitude for them. This is because in Trinity Second Edition, psions were going to have a Primary Aptitude, 2 Secondaries, and everything else as Tertiary.

[astronomer]

Sweet deal! Looks like when BC comes out, psions become more interesting. I always thought the artificial lock on aptitudes created by the Doyen was annoying. Can't wait to kick their noetic butts. Playing a psiad was cool, but not being able to get that 5th dot was disappointing. Haven't seen anyone ask lately, so ... any timeline on BC's arrival? A Breed Apart only whetted my appetite, I need more, pleaseeeee ... Ahem. Keep up the good work, 'cause GM types like myself are always on the lookout for new thoughts and approaches.

[Heru]

Sweet deal! Looks like when BC comes out, psions become more interesting. I always thought the artificial lock on aptitudes created by the Doyen was annoying. Can't wait to kick their noetic butts. Playing a psiad was cool, but not being able to get that 5th dot was disappointing. Haven't seen anyone ask lately, so ... any timeline on BC's arrival? A Breed Apart only whetted my appetite, I need more, pleaseeeee ... Ahem. Keep up the good work, 'cause GM types like myself are always on the lookout for new thoughts and approaches.

I have to completely second this, all of this.

[Blue Thunder]

I can't give a date for BC. Thing is, we have spurts of activity in the BC project forum. We'll be real busy, then suddenly there's no activity for a while, then repeat.

[astronomer]

Dang. The e-books are way cool when they appear, so I'll just have to practice patience. God knows I still haven't gotten it right yet. ::laugh

[Rorx]

Two ways to increase Psi power.

1. Only allow Auxillary Modes from more than one Aptitude once above Psi 6.

2. Once the reach Psi 9 allow them to purchase Noetic Merits with xp. On attaining Psi 10 let them buy Mode Natural for Modes once they reach Mode 5.

Well its a year further on and no signicant posts to the BC topic. Does anyone know what happend to Blue thunder? Or have a copy of his files so that others can try to continue the project? Perhaps for future projects a copy of working files should be kept by Eon admin so there i7 not a single point of failure for any project.