World of Darkness: Combat

[Bahamut810]

Has anyone used the WOD: Combat book in a AEon universe game? If you did, how did it work? Have you used it at all? Do you think it would work ok if you used it?

[VictorHFrost KSC]

I've used it for getting the stats on a few more exotic weapons and occasionally for suggestions on how certain maneuvers should work. The system as a whole is a lot more involved than I ever want to deal with in a normal game session though. I tend to play fast and loose, if its something that takes more than 45 seconds to work out i've lost interest, especially in tabletop combat.

Jake

[Sprocket]

I've tried it once (as a player)- it looked nice as a book, but the system bogged down the game quite a bit. My group found that the various "special maneuvers" (found in the various WoD: Asia books) worked fairly well though. ::wink

(WoD: Asia Books- Kindred of the East, Kindred of the East Companion, Tradition Book: Akashic Brotherhood, and Demon Humter X. You might want to take a look at them while you still have the chance. ::devilangel )

[ProfPotts]

I ran a long term Werewolf game some years back in which we tried out the WoD: Combat rules for quite some time. There are some interesting ideas in the book, but in actual play things don't work as well as they should.

One problem is that all characters get free 'Power Points' just for having dots of Athletics, Brawl, & Melee - & that these points can be traded back for extra freebie points at chargen if you don't want the character to be a martial arts expert (just a brawler instead). This makes those three Abilities abusively over-powered when compaired with all the other Abilities. Power Points over this initial allotment are too expensive for any characters to ever bother buying with XP - so characters will undoubtedly stick with the maneuvers they brought at chargen & never really develop their fighting styles.

The differences between the various moves are often minor & therefore not worth the extra hassle during play. A lot of them just trade accuracy for damage or initiative, or vice versa. They also lock combat descriptions to those specific maneuvers (instead of describing your character's attack in an imaginiative way you describe his 'power uppercut' again, & again, & again).

A few maneuvers are more powerful (yet more costly) than the others. This means that a character can blow a majority of their power points on buying one powerful & effective maneuver & just use it all the time (hey, why not? If you 'triple punch' allows your to hit three times per attack, then why the Hell would you ever not use the thing?). The maneuver creation rules leave this concept even more open to abuse.

Those are just the things I can recall off the top of my head. There are good points in the book (such as the first mention of a difference between Lethal & Bashing damage in a WW game) but there is also a lot of twink-potential. If you're gonna' use it I'd suggest not giving characters any of the 'free' power points for just having Abilities & make them buy any maneuvers they want to use - so a character who wants to be able to snap an enemy's neck with a single attack needs to actually sacrifice some other character element for the privalege.

The info' on guns & various ammo' types is helpful (although not as well done or as detailed as in some non-WW games), but again could be twink-fodder if not handled correctly.

Streetfighter the Roleplaying Game - the WW series which WoD: Combat was based on - is actually a pretty good game, but the system works better there because the central focus of the game is the duel-style combats between characters on the streetfighting circuit. In Streetfighter the maneuvers that power points buy are the 'special powers ' that the characters use. In WoD: Combat the maneuvers are an extra tacked on to already powerful characters to make them that little bit more powerful. In Streetfighter all the characters are meant to be martial arts experts - that's the point! In WoD you expect to run into the odd vampire or mage who hasn't mastered the arts of the warrior to an almost mystic level. ::sarcasm ::sly

With the Æonverse games the combat system is already a great improvement over what was standard WoD at the time that WoD: Combat came out. If a character wants to try a 'flying reverse turning kick' he doesn't need a specific maneuver - he just needs an appropriate background & Traits, & the ST applies difficulty / accuracy / damage adjustments as fits the situation. The TPG even has more detailed martial arts rules for those that want.

[Bahamut810]

Im doing things to keep my mind occupied. So I thought I would go through and update the system for this slightly to try and simplify the process and call attension to a few of the issues you guys saw was there...

So I bring you...

Revised NOVA KOMBAT Rules:

To gain access to the maneuvers/Martial Art:

First, include the martial art in your background and get GM permission (a no brainer there)

Second, you must have a MA (or brawl, check with your GM) score of at least 3

Third, you must buy a Speciality for the Martial Art

What you start with:

-All Free Maneuvers

-All the moves that are associated with your Martial Art that cost 1 or 2 points (Max 8 starting, player can pick which ones they take)

-Pick Half (rounded up) the maneuvers that cost 3

-You get points equal to youy MA (or Brawl) score to buy extra maneuvers with.  These may not be used as Bonus points.  You get points equal to Athletics score for athletic maneuvers.

Cost of Buying the Maneuvers:

-Bonus points can be spent to buy a maneuver at its point cost (1 bp = 1 pp)

-Experience can be spent on a 1 for 1 basis as well (1 xp = 1 pp)

-Nova points can be spent on a 3 for 1 basis (1 np = 3 pp)

-For moves that are in your fighting style, you subtract 1 from final cost (ex.  Joint lock costs 4 pp, and is in Aikido's Maneuver list.  The person who has this only has to pay 4-1=3 pp).  This does not count for custom moves.

-You must pay at least 1 pp for a move (a move that costs 1 must still pay 1 for)

Usage:

-You can only use a maneuver once per as many rounds as the point cost.  (ex. Punch which costs 1pp can be used every round.  Sword Hand which costs 4pp can only be used once every 4 rounds).

Modifications:

-Use the method described in Smackdown (Abberant Main Book, p247) for any custom moves.  However, replace "Requirement: Mega-Strength 1" with "Superpower 1" for the people who want to make a mega-gravity lifting slam type maneuver.

Just remember this is nothing serious. Just wantd to see if I could make this more likable as I like Martial Arts type suppliments (Ninjas and Superspies for Heroes Unlimited rocks).

If you guys like the idea I may take over the maneuvers that are in the aberrant book and assign them costs and such.

[Sprocket]

Hmm, this looks workable. This might fit well into that Mega-Physical book that Gideon and I discussed a while back.

(BTW, please stop by the "Forceful Personalities" forum when you get a chance, Bahamut. There's still some activity going on there, and there's some peer reviewing that needs to be done. ::wink )

[gilgamesh2206]

One of the huge problems I found was that most of the moves seemed to come straight out of the WWE catalogue ("My Get of Fenris suplexes the Brujah, then follows up with a backbreaker"...ugh). Now if you were running a XWF campaign "Combat" would probably be an excellent resource.

[Sphere]

That's a fantastic idea Gilgamesh! I may have to dig out my old WoD:Combat and have my Players make up some quantum-charged wrestlers and do a beer-and-chips session of XWF shoot-fighting.

"Devis...GET THE TABLES!!!"