Aberrant: 200X - An Issue

[Dawn OOC]

I'm bringing this up after much thought and observation. While 200x has been coasting along without the need of Mod intervention, we will have that time come. With Fox having stepped back, Seph in computerless hell and Flicker apparently vanished, I feel we need leadership.

My 'vision' of what potential mods should have or be:

• has at least one character on the 200x forum as of yesterday, Febuary 4, 2009;
• is emotionally invested in the health of the forum;
• believes in the 'vision' of 200x, as outlined in the 200x Bible;
• and is able to put in the mininal time and effort to function as a mod.

I propose that we discuss this for now. By Febuary 21, 2009, we should know if we are comfortable with the idea of reclaiming 200x. If the forum seems to be in concensus, we can begin to accept nominations. After two weeks of that, we can vote. The vote will be one of two ways: conducted secrety by someone who doesn't have a 200x character, such as PW or Dr. Kultra (I don't think he does) and overseen by Chosen.

What happens if we get this worked up, and the old mods return? I'd say work out who is the new mod with the returning mod. The current mods and the former should decide who will continue to serve as mod. I believe that the members of the forum should be polled before any decision is made, as some of us may have problems with the former mod in question.

My intention is not to cause an insurrection, but to try to regain moderation of this forum in the case that we need it. At this point, there is no one who can provide moderator functions for us, in the case that there is an OOC fight or any forum maintanance.

Thoughts? Questions? Alternate proposals?

[Charlotte]

It sounds good to me. I think a precondition of 'interm moderating' is that if one of the old mods asks the new mod to step down, they should - up to a period of one year. If there's any problems past that point, they had their chance.

I also think that since Fox IS still around that he can help administrate any changeover.

[Dawn OOC]

This is true. We should poke Fox to see if he's interested in doing that.

[Adrian Moss]

Interesting.

[Aušrinė]

I'm definitely interested to see how this works out. For the past week or so I've been writing and doing some minor maintenance to my PCs' profiles in preparation for becoming active on this forum again, but I've been concerned over the fact that there's apparently no oversight here at all. I'd love to see any of the three original Mods return, and would welcome them warmly, but with them gone I think it's only appropriate that those still active here step up and keep things going.

[Dawn OOC]

Originally Posted By: Adrian Moss

Interesting.

Feel free to post your full thoughts, positive or negative. I don't want just warm-happy-agreements. I want to know what the active members of this board think.

[Adrian Moss]

What I have to say is not a constructive comment and serves no purpose here. I was just letting people know I would like to renew my activity at some time if this new mod thing goes through.

[Ryusei Hideyoshi]

I support it I'd like to see the forum get more active again.

[Warren Verona]

Originally Posted By: Dawn, OOC

My 'vision' of what potential mods should have or be:

• has at least one character on the 200x forum as of yesterday, Febuary 4, 2009;
• is emotionally invested in the health of the forum;
• believes in the 'vision' of 200x, as outlined in the 200x Bible;
• and is able to put in the minimal time and effort to function as a mod.

Quote:

My intention is not to cause an insurrection, but to try to regain moderation of this forum in the case that we need it. At this point, there is no one who can provide moderator functions for us, in the case that there is an OOC fight or any forum maintenance.

For the most part Dawn, you are correct, 200X has done a great job of sustaining itself. This is due in part to the maturity of the players and our ability to handle our own issues. It's also due in large part to Knockout who's mission to not let this area fail has been nothing short of titanic.

So, to all the players involved I'd be willing to assist with any moderator functions, be they temporary or 'permanent'. My ST/Revenant accounts are always available to players who have questions of fairness, the 200X Bible or any other 200X related material. In the past there's been questions, but I've lacked the authority to assist in the manner I would have liked, and today those questions have remained unanswered due to a lack of Moderators.

200X, as I said, runs pretty smoothly on it's own. I don't think Moderating it would take up even a fraction of my time unless maintenance is required and certainly that's not often enough to consider it an inconvenience.

Give it some thought, either temporary or 'permanent', I'm more than willing to help out the players of 200X in an official capacity.

[Dawn OOC]

Excellent! We weren't to the suggesting moderators part yet, but I'm happy to hear people stepping up for it. You mention unasked questions, and I'd like to see them. I think that it will help the future mods to see them too. It lets people know what issues they'll have on their plate immediately.

[Warren Verona]

http://www.rpg-post.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/129979/Let_s_Talk_Strengths_and_Weakn.html#Post129979

[Nova OOC]

I know it's hard to believe, but I decided to come back earlier this evening, then just now read this thread. I had planned on just easing back into the swing of things, penning a story that's been percolating in my imagination for a few weeks, and maybe doing something official-like once I'd tested the waters.

As the saying goes, oh what the hell.

The last time I came back, I lasted all of 24 hours before I became disgusted with things all over again and walked right back out the door for about six months. As a result, I know that I don't have much credibility. How about I take it a day at a time, and if I'm still here in a week, then I'll be here for a good long time?

[Warren Verona]

Welcome back. I certainly hope you decide to stick around, you've certainly been missed. I think 200X is still two moderators short with no contingency for handling issues that require moderation should all our moderators float away again.

In a nutshell, I think we need someone more reliable at your side (or you at theirs) to handle things if/when you are not around. As it stands, if you decide to not hangout, it leaves the area right back to square one.

(And no, I'm not being antagonistic, I'm just expressing my opinions, not only to you, but to everyone else involved.)

[Dawn OOC]

Welcome back, Nova. And I concur with Dave (as terrifying as some may find that concept), at least as far as his points go on needing to replace Fox permamently and Seph temporarily.

[Nova OOC]

I'm going to open a PM dialogue with Mr. Fox and Seph, and give them two weeks to reply before adding anyone to the moderation team. I think that's only fair, and there's little risk of the forum descending into chaos in two weeks' time, so there's no need to move hastily.

Who is interested in the position(s) should one or more be available?

[SalmonMax]

*cocks back the action on his ChaosSower 2500 and grins evilly*

No...I'm sure there's nothing to worry about.

[Dawn OOC]

To be honest, Mr. Fox stepped out months ago. I don't mind waiting on Seph, but Fox is pretty much out, by his own statement. So I'd say move to fill his right now rather than waiting.

[Nova OOC]

I know Mr. Fox did. We discussed this privately last Autumn. I'd like to give him the opportunity to evaluate his position in life right now and make that decision again. Circumstances change over time.

Let's not rush anything. I don't see what is to be gained by acting hastily. As has been shown, the forum didn't disintegrate in the months that there was a power vacuum. I don't foresee sudden catastrophe within the fortnight. Let's use that time to evaluate potential successors carefully rather than make quick appointments.

In two weeks' time I'd like to be ready to announce succesors should Mr. Fox and Seph not be available.

[Kazuo]

Waiting two weeks sounds fine with me. I'd personally like to see both Fox and Seph return to their duties, as I like 'em both as Mods.

Assuming they don't, however, I know that Dave has put his own hat in the ring in that regard. If no one else steps forward/volunteers, then I'll go ahead and offer my services as well. I understand the rules well enough to feel comfortable fielding strange requests and custom powers/rules, and I've STed a few games. If Fox and/or Seph return however, or if others better qualified step forward, they can have the position with my congratulations.

[Vivi OOC]

My characters are largely inactive. That being said, however, I would prefer to see active people in the Mod roles. The fact that it's sustained itself this long tells me that, while it can function without Moderators, it has more or less ceased to "belong" to anyone, and the decision should be left up to the players- not someone who appears and disappears.

Nova, with no disrespect intended, I don't think you have the right (the ability, certainly, given the mechanics of the forums) to make decisions for 200X at this point. There are people here who think highly of you, obviously, but I think you owe the players a bit more (if you want to remain as a Mod) than a post saying "maybe I'll stick around."

I'm trying very hard to keep my personal feelings personal, and while I understand your request for a little time to see if you're going to stick around, I think you would have been better served by first proving your commitment by being active again as a player and then stating you'd like to take up the reins officially.

[Dawn OOC]

The only reason I'm pushing for faster resolution is because I'm honestly concerned that you'll leave again before the two weeks are done. That's not meant as an insult, but as a concern supported by previous actions. As much as I hate to express something which is probably going to hurt your feelings, I'm not sure I can trust that you'll remain for the long term.

Since mod selections are on-going, I'd like to recommend Nathan (and poke him to speak up) for a mod slot; he's put a lot into this forum when everyone else, including me, had given up on it. I'll also throw my backing behind Centimane/Whitearrow and Reven. Both would do a fine job.

[Nova OOC]

Originally Posted By: Vivi OOC

I think you would have been better served by first proving your commitment by being active again as a player and then stating you'd like to take up the reins officially.

That was my plan, but the creation of this thread has forced my hand. I'd hoped to pop in, write a nice* story, start talking to people again, and let the topic of forum leadership come up in due course. It wasn't my desire to face this so soon, but there's not much I can do about it at this point, aside from to do my best with what lies before me.

You're right, I do owe more than a post which says "maybe I'll stick around," but right now I believe that my credibility is uncertain. I don't have the standing to boldly proclaim "I'm back, and this time I'm not fooling!" Such a post would be met with skepticism at best, and howls of derisive laughter at worst. I have humbled myself by my inactivity and unpredictability, and I know that it will take time to re-earn the trust of the others here.

Since my words are not worth as much as they used to be, I am left with my deeds. Going forward, I intend to demonstrate measured and thoughtful leadership. I'd like the opportunity to demonstrate that ability. If I fail, the forum will be no worse off than if I had not tried.



(* Well, actually a very bloody one, but one I could be proud of.)

[Nova OOC]

Originally Posted By: Dawn, OOC

The only reason I'm pushing for faster resolution is because I'm honestly concerned that you'll leave again before the two weeks are done.

There's no harm if I do leave before two weeks have elapsed, is there? If I don't stick around, then the confederacy of writers can appoint a new council and petition Chosen to install them as moderators.

It's been months. What's two weeks?

[Nova OOC]

Three consecutive posts is bad form, so apologies in advance. I've just heard from Mr. Fox, and he has respectfully declined the offer. One moderator position is definitely available.

[Adrian Moss]

Welcome back Nova. Fox does need to be replaced. Seph has been gone a long time, and this has become a habit of him here, excellent contributor that he is. He needs to be replaced. If this can be done know, we won't have the problem of new writers having characer questions and having no reliable authority to answer them.

My 2c anyway.

(Nova, I'm Jager btw.)

[Warren Verona]

If your back as a player Nova, excellent, welcome back. As far as a Moderator goes, unfortunately I can not accept that. You and Seph (there is no longer any reason to include Fox) have, in my opinion, forfeited your positions through:

1. Lack of attendance.

2. Lack of participation.

3. Failure to address 200X player related issues.

If we use Dawn's guidelines (which are fairly accurate) then we clearly see that our moderators do not meet the criteria of what is expected by the players of 200X (no one disputed the guidelines, so I'm assuming no one has any issues with it).

I know this sounds as if I'm trying to be cold, and I assure you, I'm not. The three listed qualities above are not what I want from a moderator, nor does anyone else as far as I can tell (or else this thread would not exist).

Now, I certainly hope this process continues to go smoothly, and at the end of the discussion date if the writers of 200X wish for you to have your status back, so be it, I don't care who the moderators are as long as the job is getting done. At that time you'll be joined by whomever is decided to work with you (and I feel this should be our decision).

It's not my intention to play the 'Bad Guy' (despite my proficiency), I try to look at things as honestly as I would if I were dealing with all of you face to face.

I just hope you can appreciate the honesty and not take it personally.

[Eingar]

In the interests of making my position clear:

Nova, it'd be nice to have you back writing and gaming with us. If you are standing as a prospective Mod then you have my support.

So does Dave/Revenant.

So does Kazuo/Centimane.

I think all 3 of you could potentially be good Mods, bringing different views and ideas into any discussions that would make the 200X board more efficiently and happily run.

I'm not so interested in one of the Old Guard coming back and saying "Wait, I'm here now, so there's no need for any process to continue."

My vote is that we continue to move with the discussion for new Mods: Nova, you are more than welcome in my book to put yourself forward as a 'New Mod' if you choose to stick around. So far, the names that have stepped forward are all ones I associate with good writing and fun times. Yes, Rev, even you. Stop blushing.

Let the selection process continue.

[Nova OOC]

We're not going to use Dawn's guidelines.

Dave, I left because of you. When I returned and then disappeared again after only a few days, it was because of you. Every time I almost click on the link to this website and then don't, it's because of you. I don't like you. I don't like coming to this site because of you.

I've lost count of the number of times I've been angry over something you've said on this forum. On a forum! It's not even life or death. It's just words on a forum, and yet you are marvelously gifted at getting under my skin in a way that nobody else can.

I want to have a good time on this website. I want to write good stories here. I don't want to fight anyone, and I especially don't want to deal with you. The only way I can accommodate all of these goals is by ignoring you, and that's what I'm going to do.

We're through, Dave. A long time ago I liked you and you liked me. Sometime in the past year or so that changed, and I don't know how it happened, or even when, or why, but it did. It perplexed me, and I thought it was a phase, but it stuck. Time and time again you keep pissing me off. I can't have that. I won't have that.

Good bye Dave.

[Warren Verona]

Sorry you feel that way.

Bye.

[Nova OOC]

Now then, I'd like to lay out my intentions so that they're plain to all. I'd like to do all of the following:

1) Have fun.

2) Not fight people.

3) Interview prospective mods over the next two weeks via private messages.

4) Appoint one or two (one if Seph wants to return, two if he does not) mods in two weeks' time.

5) Write stories.

6) Have fun.

7) Not fight people.

I'm serious about fun and not fighting people. I want this to be fun, and I want to get along with the people I write with. I hope that is as many people as possible.

[Eingar]

Originally Posted By: Nova OOC

We're not going to use Dawn's guidelines.

Actually we are. It is no longer your decision alone.

Now if you were saying "Goodbye Dave" to mean that you're leaving again, then the rest of this post is irrelevant.

If you mean "Goodbye" in the sense of "I'm kicking you outta my game", then understand that from where I stand, and from my point of view of a fair few others, you have forfeited your Mod rights here. And refusing to work within the process Dawn has outlined and a lot of people approve of is not just arrogant, it's insulting. And don't think you have the moral high ground after that attack on Dave.

I'd like to say sorry about this, but you turn around right after my post about how I'm NOT interested in one of the old Mods just turning up and us not needing to decide on anything anymore and ignore it.

I'm not sorry.

It's up to you how you play this, but we have a majority here who, in your absence, decided to keep 200X alive and kicking, somehow managing not to self-destruct and have a lot of fun along the way.

Join us, or step aside please.

[Warren Verona]

I feel any further participation in this thread by me will only cause larger issues. I'll be backing out and simply observing.

Everything I've said I've meant up to this point and I've said it with all fairness in mind and without any malice intended towards Nova, Seph, or Fox.

Good luck solving this everyone.

[Forge]

I have no stake in this at all, but my thoughts on the situation are thus:

Like any organization, have a nomination period, have a primary (to narrow it down) and then vote.

If the incumbant wants another term, so be it, but just because the incumbant wants to, doesn't mean they get auto-appointment.

Keep it democratic.

[Nova OOC]

Originally Posted By: Einherjar

Now if you were saying "Goodbye Dave" to mean that you're leaving again, then the rest of this post is irrelevant.

If you mean "Goodbye" in the sense of "I'm kicking you outta my game", then understand that from where I stand, and from my point of view of a fair few others, you have forfeited your Mod rights here.

Neither of those are my meaning.

My meaning is that I am no longer going to allow Dave to get under my skin. I'm going to do this by pretending that he does not exist. At no point did I say that I intend to quit, nor did I say that I intend to kick him out.

I claim my authority by virtue of this forum being my idea in the first place. I proposed the idea, I worked tirelessly for a long time getting it going, bending over backwards to accommodate as many opinions as possible, and enduring one of the most epic motherfuckings to ever take place on this website. Through it all I persisted because I had one goal in mind: to do it right.

I almost had it. Almost. My only failure was that I had insufficient stamina to absorb all of that punishment and then follow through and quash hostile disagreement. I was too loose, too slack, and I let too much trouble slide. I was worn out, and unsure of my moral compass. It happens sometimes, I'm human after all.

I've got a fresh point of view, re-entering the site after my absence. I've come back to find that the place is full of greatness and potential, yes, but it is also full of Forum Warrior roleplay drama llamas. I'm not interested in forum fighting, high-school drama club popularity club nonsense, or being liked by as many people as possible. I've come back to reclaim what is mine, created by my vision.

Yeah, that probably sounds arrogant. It should. I poured my all into this forum, and I'm well and proud of what I've done, yet all it did was suck me dry.

The point is, time does not diminish my acts, although it may obscure them. I'm back, I'm re-energized, and if you would like the opportunity to suck me dry yet again, here I am. But at least this time the foundation is already laid. This time I'll go farther than last time, because I stand on my prior work. This time I'm not messing around.

Let's have some fun.

[Nova OOC]

By the by: I am on pins and needles waiting to see what happens next in the coffee shop with Ein, Kayo, and Jael. That's the sort of thing I love to see, and hope to keep on seeing. The interplay of three characters who are so very different yet have such weirdly intersecting orbits is fascinating. =D

[Charlotte]

There's no real methodology for replacing a subforum mod. We've been having this problem in the play-by-post game In The Beginning, where we have been waiting quite a while for Titan to poke his head back in and continue on with the main plot. I've been trying to come up with a solution that does allow Titan to pick up his plot should he return, because I feel that it is his game, even if he's not around. I feel the same way about 200X, which is why I wrote what I did about any new mods being accepted on the condition that a returning mod has seniority.

That's my opinion on the subject, although as I pointed out: with no system in place it's as valid as the next one. Nova has a legitimate POV in saying that 200X is her forum to moderate, even if it's not the only one.

If people choose to see her moderation as illegitimate, that's their choice, of course. But then the question is 'what do we do about it.' What I'd recommend is this: keep Nova, get two new moderators.

Nova gets to thereby retain her stake in the forum while we get other moderators in the event that Nova isn't committed. That's the purpose behind having three mods, and no one says they have to all be selected at once. I don't think they need to be elected - no one elected them before, did they? - but I won't be opposed to an election as long as people understand we have a VERY small player base here and that's going to skew the numbers a lot, not to mention that people will be able to vote more or less anonymously.

[The Fine Balance]

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[Nova OOC]

Originally Posted By: Alex OOC

I'm sceptical as to whether Nova will stick with it.

...Sour grapes for me, eh?

That's a fair shot to take. I did poke my head in the door and announce a grand return once before. As I said upthread, I can only prove my commitment, I cannot just announce it and expect it to be taken at face value.

[z017]

I agree with Dave on this. You left, Nova. Twice. That's fine in a player, as this is place to have fun. That's not cool in mod.

As far as claiming authority because you started the board, that to me is not a good enough reason to ignore the fact that you left. You walk back in and demand that we kowtow to you and give you authority over us when you were the one that walked away from your responsibilities.

No.

Just no.

This board was kept going by other people, and those people have put forward a method to address the lack of leadership. I understand being overwhelmed, by the forum and by life. That happened to me in MCoH. I started that board and would never claim control of the place as you have simply because I once had an idea. I found people to replace me and the took my leave. You didn't even do that.

You're right. You have pretty much zero credibility right now. The people posting here have offered solutions to the problems you left the forum with when you disappeared. Please respect that. Stand up for the moderator nominations if you would like to continue having authority here. If posters here still have faith in you or want to grant you another opportunity, then so be it.

Demanding anything of the people here now is obnoxious and an affront to the work they've done in you absence.

I'll put the same disclaimer Dave did, that none of this is intended as a personal attack. It isn't. I am, however, quite offended by your attitude, most especially in the face of the grace and genial nature of most poster's responses to your return.

[The Fine Balance]

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