Talk of an Official Aeon Gameline Reboot

[Sprocket]

Your fame is legendary in these parts BECAUSE of your commitment to putting out the highest quality product Sprocket.

<Shrugs> Then would you be willing to commit to doing peer review & proofreading? If so, I will post the Introduction section here on this thread for feedback. Further sections will follow as completed/pre-polished. Can't maintain quality without some critical eyes, 'cause as Papa Hemingway said : "the first draft of anything is s#!t."

We will also need some fluff material - not an overwhelming amount, just enough to whet appetites for the crunchy sections of the book. I'm currently drawing blanks on what would fit for that. Cover art & the opening fiction can both be left to the collective ingenuity of the RPG Post community this time around.

Re: Metaplot-

I'll be addressing that in AB:Nexus, although in a sideways manner. We'll just have to differentiate between what are inescapable consequences of human nature and what are consequences of The Wretched Metaplot™. Hopefully, the former can be addressed and the latter tossed out the window.

[SkyLion]

Well I'm an admirer of your work, though I am probably not the most wizened person here to be doing peer review. Others probably have a better eye for system than I do...

[Sakurako Hino]

Well, when it comes to fluff, particularly when someone wants something to fit a certain setting, it would depend on what you're looking for.

I may be up for contributing depending on how much change is to be done.

[Sprocket]

Re: peer review-

Don't sweat it, SkyLion. Once you make a habit of it, hunting down text errors (grammatical, spelling, incorrect setting info, etc.) isn't all that hard. You'll just be (later on) sharing the experience of agonizing over those little errors you did miss correcting, especially if you wrote them yourself. If you feel up to it, you'd be welcome.

Re: Fluff- Not to worry, I'll be posting the outline for AB:Nexus here shortly. As for what sort of fluff we need, a lot of it will be Fortean Times articles as they would be written in the Aberrant Era. UFO encounters, cryptozoological enounters, hauntings, timeslips & passages to other worlds, stuff like that all mixed in with the Nova/Inspired weirdness that's already prevalent in the setting.

[Sprocket]

Aberrant: Nexus, topic elements-

0: Fluff section

1- Opening Fiction Piece

2- Setting Color/Fluff pieces

3- Introduction <Finished, for now.>

I: Metaplot and setting backstories

(We are missing so much of the overall metaplot data that it isn't even funny.)

1- The Grand Metaplot of the Aeon Continuum

a: Adventure!

b: Aberrant

c: Trinity

2- Aeon Continuum Timeline <Finished>

II: Time Travel & Crosstime Travel, examined

a- Split Continua: The 3 Aeon timelines and your chronicle.

> The "Double-Slit Max" conundrum must be addressed here - if there are three main Aeon Continuum timelines, which one a given chronicle is set in must be determined.

i: Continuum 1 is timeline presented in Trinity, Continuum 2 is timeline presented in Aberrant, Continuum 3 is timeline presented in Adventure!.

ii: differences between "Absolute Now"; is 2120s in Trinity, 2015 in Aberrant & 1923 in Adventure!.

b- Who Makes The World? : Shapers of history.

i: Max Mercer: Did his initial time-jumps actualize the established metaplot(s) of the Aeon Continua, making them eventual concrete eventualities instead of mere possibilities?

ii: Divis Mal: Despite his being hampered by his mental aberrations, can the plans of a Mega-Int 8 nova be stopped, or even be detected in time to do so? Should they even be stopped in the first place?

iii: Nova/aberrant time travelers: trying to prevent the Aberrant War or alter it's predetermined outcome.

iv: Psion time travelers: attempting to do the same, only for their side.

v: Human Nature: Against human stupidity, the gods themselves contend in vain. Is that true?

vi: All of the Above & then some.

c- general interesting uses, abuses & consequences of same for these powers.

III: Crossover & Game Mechanics

(Pretty much all the important stuff, some of which has been covered elsewhere but will be included for the sake of completeness.)

IV: Weirdness

a- Fortean Events: what to expect when local telluric energy levels rise a bit too sharply.

b- Nova-related weirdness.

c- Psi Forms: Ghosts, spirits & stranger things.

d- The collective unconsciousness of humanity / "Sea of Dreams" / the noetic species conglomerate.

V: Appendices

1- New Powers, etc.

<Finished, for now.>

2- Extrasolar Space

3- The Doyen (distillation of the above discussion, plus other tidbits).

=====

Re: Chapter Structure for Aberrant: Nexus-

Introduction

Chapter 1: The Aeon Continuum

Chapter 2: Soujourns In Time, Space & The Multiverse

Chapter 3: Crossover Mechanics

Chapter 4: Other Weirdness

Appendix #1: New Powers, etc.

Appendix #2: The Doyen

[June O'Gara]

Well... this seems interesting (Endeavor here, BTW), LEt me think about this, I got a few games starting up here.

[Sprocket]

Well... this seems interesting (Endeavor here, BTW), LEt me think about this, I got a few games starting up here.

That's perfectly O.K. BTW, would you be intrested in doing peer review/proofreading? Being "wizened" isn't a requirement AFAIK.

,,

Re: Getting back on the main topic-

,,

I just want one thing, placed at the front of the book and made bold for everyone to see, even those wearing coke-bottle glasses.

"One thing should be made clear, this is YOUR universe when you run this. You don't even have to run our plot. Just remember that by doing so you won't be hamstrung by things we made in here as in how our plot meshes with the rules. Overall, as long as you are telling wonderful stories and having amazing adventures, we have done our job brilliantly."

People honestly feel they need permission fo go off the reservation with these Storyteller games. Maybe that should be put in there as a "You have our permission to diverge" thing.

,,

I think its more than there shouldn't be any plot. Someone earlier mentioned Eberron as a great example beccause it dangles a bunch of threads but doesn't explain any of them or advance any metaplot whatsoever. It gives you a canvas a brush and a huge toolkit of paint and says "have fun with your creations in this world."

,,

Agreed. Let us play with things. Don't railroad us into a metaplot if we don't want to use it.

THIS, in glowing neon boldface if need be. I always found that the oWoD meme of "personal liberation through being pre-emptively & inevitably doomed" to be nothing but a millstone that drains away any pleasure from the roleplaying experience.

[Mr Fox]

THIS, in glowing neon boldface if need be. I always found that the oWoD meme of "personal liberation through being pre-emptively & inevitably doomed" to be nothing but a millstone that drains away any pleasure from the roleplaying experience.

I always just ignored the crap out of that aspect of all of WW's products. Not that I ran in or played happy-go-lucky games, they were definitely gritty and realistic, but I never forced inevitable doom on my players, via taint, humanity, Paradox, or whatever.

[Jordan]

Hey Sprocket, I have a question and some suggestions you can pass along. Are they using the same basic game mechanics as Aberrant or a version of the NWoD rules?

,,

As for my suggestions; I would like to see a more detailed Table of Contents and Index to make searching the book easier. I'd like to see more clarity in the rules and more examples of what the rules intend. I'd like to see the powers turned into more of a toolkit with an extra/flaw system that allows for better customization rather then just a sidebar that says "work with you ST to make something new." I'd like to see Taint changed so that gaining power doesn't automatically turn your character into a taint buttered freak (this isn't WoD after-all).

,,

I'd like to see a better balance between the baseline and the not-baseline. I'd like to see the rules reflect the fluff and vice-verse. Don't sit there and tell me that Novas as a whole were afraid of Nukes when you have team tomorrow/teregen level characters running about

,,

Fluff-wise I'd like to see them make the game more about the players and less about the super special snowflake NPCs running about the setting. Aeon actually did this fairly well, and Adventure wasn't too bad about it either, but Aberrant was terrible for this.

,,

If you could pass this along in whatever thread the developers read that would be awesome Sprocket

[SalmonMax]

Oh dear god yes, Jordan nailed it. Table of Contents. Right in the beginning. Nothing before it. No fluff. No flavor. No...half a book's worth of glossy 'setting material.' And an INDEX. Last pages should be that.

,,

That is like...the thing I hate MOST about Aberrant's books. More than the cheesy cover art. More than the rules gaps or metaplot. Organize. The. Damn. Books. Sensibly.

,,

Fix the other stuff too, but DEFINITELY fix that.

[Sprocket]

I always just ignored the crap out of that aspect of all of WW's products. Not that I ran in or played happy-go-lucky games, they were definitely gritty and realistic, but I never forced inevitable doom on my players, via taint, humanity, Paradox, or whatever.

Likewise here. If a PC winds up doomed, it ought to be as a logical consequence of his/her/its own actions. It's also part of why I helped come up with the Qi Meng Combat Style in Aberrant:The New Flesh.

,,

Hey Sprocket, I have a question and some suggestions you can pass along. Are they using the same basic game mechanics as Aberrant or a version of the NWoD rules?

,,

As for my suggestions; I would like to see a more detailed Table of Contents and Index to make searching the book easier. I'd like to see more clarity in the rules and more examples of what the rules intend. I'd like to see the powers turned into more of a toolkit with an extra/flaw system that allows for better customization rather then just a sidebar that says "work with you ST to make something new." I'd like to see Taint changed so that gaining power doesn't automatically turn your character into a taint buttered freak (this isn't WoD after-all).

,,

I'd like to see a better balance between the baseline and the not-baseline. I'd like to see the rules reflect the fluff and vice-verse. Don't sit there and tell me that Novas as a whole were afraid of Nukes when you have team tomorrow/teregen level characters running about

,,

Fluff-wise I'd like to see them make the game more about the players and less about the super special snowflake NPCs running about the setting. Aeon actually did this fairly well, and Adventure wasn't too bad about it either, but Aberrant was terrible for this.

,,

If you could pass this along in whatever thread the developers read that would be awesome Sprocket

,,

Oh dear god yes, Jordan nailed it. Table of Contents. Right in the beginning. Nothing before it. No fluff. No flavor. No...half a book's worth of glossy 'setting material.' And an INDEX. Last pages should be that.

,,

That is like...the thing I hate MOST about Aberrant's books. More than the cheesy cover art. More than the rules gaps or metaplot. Organize. The. Damn. Books. Sensibly.

,,

Fix the other stuff too, but DEFINITELY fix that.

So, putting the TOC in the back was a bad move? No problem for me, AB:Nexus will likely be short enough to that the inner title & credits can share a page w/ the TOC.

,,

As for Onyx Path, I have no path of communication with them - I'm not registered at their forums, & I've only ever lurked at RPGNet. You'll have to talk with them yourselves. I also have no idea what game mechanics system or content organization scheme they'll be using. I'm just as in the dark as the rest of us.

,,

On Indexing AB:Nexus-

That's a last-minute job if IIRC, to be finished when all the other text/interior art has been formatted, to establish page numbers & whatnot. Your suggestion is heeded, but it's still putting the cart before the horse a bit.

[IanW]

Second, I don't hold out much hope for any of the "new but not really new" products being out out by Onyx Path. Considering that this is the same writing team that consistently gave us stuff we complained about in WOD and Abby, I'm not expecting anything new or exciting. I'm expecting them to be a retread of all the same tired, meta-plot heavy crap they gave us before.

Now, I am hoping for something more than that and if they deliver, I will be t h r i l l e d. But until then, I'm not holding my breath.

,,

I'm part of the same writing team? Funny, I certainly don't recall having written anything for the Trinity Universe the first time around...

,,

And I'm the guy in charge of it this time! Man, I should really check my records. My memory is for crap.

,,

Oddly enough we don't even have a writing team picked yet, so I'm not sure where you're getting your insider info.

[Mr Fox]

Ian, Glad you are following the discussion here as well. I registered on the other site and added my 2 cents a month or so ago. I've been a little busy recently to check back over there for status of how the discussion is going. It's good to know that you guys are listening to the fans.

[Sprocket]

I'm part of the same writing team? Funny, I certainly don't recall having written anything for the Trinity Universe the first time around...

,,

And I'm the guy in charge of it this time! Man, I should really check my records. My memory is for crap.

,,

Oddly enough we don't even have a writing team picked yet, so I'm not sure where you're getting your insider info.

It's not like you haven't been mistaken for one of the original developers before, Ian. IIRC, I made that very same goof back in EON's heydays. Seriously though, I'm very pleased to see you in charge of the new versions and keeping tabs on the player feedback here & elsewhere. Best of luck!

[Mary Masters]

Sprocket, this is Endeavor, feel free to correspond to this profile. Once I can see what you're aiming at I might be up to contributing.

[Sprocket]

Re: Tommy OOC-

Right, will send you the current version of the Introduction segment as an RTF in a PM. Hopefully that should help give you an idea of what the books will be covering & what my writing's like w/out the benefit of peer review.

[Sakurako Hino]

I'll take a look and give a little feedback. Best I can do to help.

[Jordan]

never mind

[Dawn OOC]

I'm part of the same writing team? Funny, I certainly don't recall having written anything for the Trinity Universe the first time around...

,,

And I'm the guy in charge of it this time! Man, I should really check my records. My memory is for crap.

,,

Oddly enough we don't even have a writing team picked yet, so I'm not sure where you're getting your insider info.

Ian, that's the word of mouth that I got from a friend of mine. If that's not true, then cool, but that's the perception I'm getting from other gamers I talk to. And by taking on another company's IP, you're going to take on their baggage as well, until you can prove you aren't retreading the old ground. In fact, that's pretty much what my friend said, that you guys were publishing a game that was decades old instead of putting out something new. That perception is not fair, but that is life. Many of us both love and dislike various aspects of Aeon, and we'll be watching closely to see what you keep and reject from the reboot.

,,

As an aside, I'm glad you're paying attention to fan sites; that is a good sign and gives me a bit of hope. I'm sure if you start asking the opinions of people around here, you'll get plenty of feedback.

[Matt]

Ian used to run Wolf Spoor and participated on pretty much every Trinity Universe online resource. While he wasn't part of the development team back then I would say that is was one of the biggest supporter of the Trinity Universe. I'm very glad to see that he is involved with the new incarnation.

[IanW]

Ian, that's the word of mouth that I got from a friend of mine. If that's not true, then cool, but that's the perception I'm getting from other gamers I talk to. And by taking on another company's IP, you're going to take on their baggage as well, until you can prove you aren't retreading the old ground. In fact, that's pretty much what my friend said, that you guys were publishing a game that was decades old instead of putting out something new. That perception is not fair, but that is life. Many of us both love and dislike various aspects of Aeon, and we'll be watching closely to see what you keep and reject from the reboot.

,,

As an aside, I'm glad you're paying attention to fan sites; that is a good sign and gives me a bit of hope. I'm sure if you start asking the opinions of people around here, you'll get plenty of feedback.

,,

Lesson: don't accept word of mouth. Check with official sources.

,,

The only thing I've ever really publicly said is "it's too early to say anything." Your friend is making shit up. I'm in charge of the new stuff, and both Andrew Bates and Bruce Baugh have given me words of support. Rich Thomas thought I was the right person for the job, because I have clear knowledge and passion about the entire Trinity Universe. I defer to his judgment.

,,

We've got John Snead in charge of Æon material. While he's written for Trinity before, he has his own vision for the line, and we're working together to bring a fresh new take to the setting. We're both excited about it. He's only just started picking some writers, and many of them haven't written for Trinity before.

,,

We're not just rereleasing the same material. Everything's up on DriveThruRPG, so there's no point in repeating what's already available. I have a couple of dramatic changes in mind, but it's too early to mention them yet, because things could still change. We don't even have an outline for the books yet. That's how early we are.

,,

Please, have faith. I have a deep love of the Trinity Continuum, and I want this to be awesome.

,,

Yes, the setting is 15 years old, but on top of this new edition, we are also creating new games like Cavaliers of Mars. We're not doing the Trinity Continuum "instead" of new stuff, we're doing it "in addition" to new stuff.

[IanW]

Ian used to run Wolf Spoor and participated on pretty much every Trinity Universe online resource. While he wasn't part of the development team back then I would say that he was one of the biggest supporter of the Trinity Universe. I'm very glad to see that he is involved with the new incarnation.

Thanks. (:

[Sprocket]

We've got John Snead in charge of Æon material. While he's written for Trinity before, he has his own vision for the line, and we're working together to bring a fresh new take to the setting. We're both excited about it. He's only just started picking some writers, and many of them haven't written for Trinity before.

,,

We're not just rereleasing the same material. Everything's up on DriveThruRPG, so there's no point in repeating what's already available. I have a couple of dramatic changes in mind, but it's too early to mention them yet, because things could still change. We don't even have an outline for the books yet. That's how early we are.

,,

Please, have faith. I have a deep love of the Trinity Continuum, and I want this to be awesome.

,,

Yes, the setting is 15 years old, but on top of this new edition, we are also creating new games like Cavaliers of Mars. We're not doing the Trinity Continuum "instead" of new stuff, we're doing it "in addition" to new stuff.

Good news indeed! I really enjoyed the work Mr. Snead did for Trinity: Stellar Frontier - I swear he made those extrasolar colonies realistic enough without being pedestrian that they just about breathed.

[NuclearMind]

I'm sorry I missed this topic on it's initial run-through. While I understand everyone's concerns (there's no way they could make these games into the games we all have pictured in our heads, let's face it), I still hold out hope that the game is old enough with enough feedback that the more egregious errors can be fixed without too many people feeling left out playstyle-wise.

,,

Other than that, I agree with almost all the suggestions being presented here. Especially the indexing and table of contents. L4-L6 powers could be separated into their own section, with yellow tape that says STORYTELLER-OPTION ONLY!, and that should be that. Metaplot...I'm pretty sure that the Onyx Path guys have heard enough complaints about metaplot with the new exalted they're working on that it shouldn't be an issue.

,,

What i'm hoping for is if they come up with better ways to customize and tweak powers a bit, help each PC be a little more distinct. That was one of the things that made me switch my Aberrant games to Wild Talents for awhile.

[IanW]

NuclearMind, on 23 Mar 2013 - 19:22, said:

I'm sorry I missed this topic on it's initial run-through. While I understand everyone's concerns (there's no way they could make these games into the games we all have pictured in our heads, let's face it), I still hold out hope that the game is old enough with enough feedback that the more egregious errors can be fixed without too many people feeling left out playstyle-wise.

We intend to allow for more options rather than fewer.

Quote

Other than that, I agree with almost all the suggestions being presented here. Especially the indexing and table of contents. L4-L6 powers could be separated into their own section, with yellow tape that says STORYTELLER-OPTION ONLY!, and that should be that.

This is only applicable if A) we still structure powers such that L4-6 powers exist, and we include them in the core rules. I wouldn't bet on both being true.

Quote

Metaplot...I'm pretty sure that the Onyx Path guys have heard enough complaints about metaplot with the new exalted they're working on that it shouldn't be an issue.

The only metaplot we're planning is that, in an official sense, Aberrant will be the future of Adventure!, and Aeon of Aberrant. Within each game line, time will effectively remain static. If you want to use the future games as a direction to head in, you can tell the story yourself. If you don't, you're free to forge your own stories without feeling hampered by what we're up to.

[Mr Fox]

I am fine with the big earth shaking powers being in a supplement, but I do hope that you include them.