5 replies to this topic

[Blue Thunder]

This actually doesn't have anything to do with A Breed Apart per se (and isn't meant as a critical attack on ABA), but it was added into the e-book.  I may as well bring it up now, because I've been wanting to ask about it for a while now...

From A Breed Apart, sidebar, pg. 30:

In this sourcebook, we’ve gone along with Bruce Baugh’s
ideas on the nature of daredevils. According to him daredevils are
paramorphs, capable of subconsciously manipulating perpendicular
time (also known as probability) to perform extraordinary feats.
Max Mercer happens to be a highly advanced example of the
breed, as shown by his ability to consciously control linear time.

I don't remember Baugh ever saying any of this, anywhere.  It's not in Asia Ascendant or Terra Verde, the only two books he was in charge of (as far as I know).  And it's not in any other Aeon material.  I don't recall either AsAs or TeVe ever giving a definition of daredevil abilities mentioning probability manipulation, and neither book mentions Max's powers.  And I've never heard of Baugh grouping Max into the same group as daredevils; I always thought Baugh had Max as something entirely different.  But if one of the books mentions any of these facts, then please copy and paste the passage(s) in question so I can see them.

This isn't the first time this has come up...but I fail to find a source.  Where does everyone keep getting this assumption from?  I'm at a loss.  Was it an interview from a few years ago or something?  I seem to remember someone mentioning how this was all just a theory/idea invented by an Aeon fan.  That's just what I remember reading once.  I'm not sure if it is true, and I may be remembering wrong.

But really, how are we all accepting this as canon when it isn't in any of the official material?  Since it isn't in any of the printed (or official e-book) material...than Bates' version of daredevils is actually the canon version of daredevils, I would think.  A lot of people here don't accept interviews and e-mails from developers as canon, and if the part about daredevils is from a Baugh interview/e-mail, why does everyone accept the "daredevils affect probability" part as canon?  If this is the case, Bates' version of daredevils takes precedence over Baugh's.

This has been bugging me for a while.  I have yet to find anything about daredevils affecting probability.  Anywhere.  So if someone can point out a source, I'll be happy...

[Ian Watson]

This comes from me, repeating AberrantEyes' theory, and (particularly the "perpendicular time = probability" bit) was used in the Trinity ST Handbook. It fits nicely with the conversations I've had with Bruce, but he's never explicitly said anything like that to the best of my knowledge.

[Blue Thunder]

That's right, it was you that said a fan came up with the idea.

[Finbar]

Also, apparently, Baugh was apparently quoted as saying that he would have made the daredevils unstuck in time, like Mercer but not as powerful. If it helps...

FR

[Ian Watson]

That's right, it was you that said a fan came up with the idea.

Reading the original post in more detail, it was Andrew Bates' assertion that Mercer was a "paramorph," and the only one. Daredevils were just regular people. So Max = paramorph, but Max != daredevil, and paramorph != daredevil.

Bruce, however, was of the opinion that daredevils = paramorphs, and Max was simply as far beyond your average daredevil as Donighal was above your average stalwart. This interpretation (Max = paramorph = daredevil) is supported in published materials.

[SkyLion]

I think that it depends on how one chooses to play Adventure!.

For example one may (as many A! groups have discovered) play it simply as an awesome Pulp game, disregarding the metaplot entirely.

I think what happened is that Baugh took over development of the line, and had it not been canceled their would have been more for all three including Asia Ascendant.Baugh was merely trying to bring consistency to the overall line.  In a "straight" pulp gam, daredvils are like Bates version...it's just a convention of the genre  and exists unto itself.  it needs no explanation.

However if one is operating under the idea that all the pseudoparanormal stuff happening in the 1920s actually *must* fit into the continuity of "science" that explains the goings on of the Aberrant and trinity eras then consitency is a good thing.  Under such circumstances saying that Donnighal is an advanced Stalwart, ie Nova, and Daredevils are *just* daredevils, while Max is the strange unique departure that doesn't relate at all with the changes happening to everyone else is just silly.

And it makes a cool sort of sense.  A daredevil possed of the knack Death Defiance defies death again and again.  Death Defiance is a dramatic editing knack, and what is dramatic editing if not altering the timeline.  So paramorphs (and to a lesser extent the other categories, since both Memerits and Stalwarts need to spend Inspiration points to fuel their powers and therefore tend to focus less on DE...) have this subtle ability to rewrite reality in their favor.

So I guess Im just saying that ya need to define how you are playing the game and proceed from there.  Is that Mesmerist *really* using Occult knowledge and power or is he just manipulating Psi and Quantum?  The argument between Bates vs. Baugh is really more about the difference between the Pulp and Sci-Fi genres.